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Old 11-20-2007, 03:07 PM   #1
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Default how to darken stain

Hey. Working on a 40 year old house and trying to match wood on new addition with original stain from older part of house. It looks like they may have added paint to the stain. Do any of you guys know how this may have been done. The homeowner is up in arms because the stain is so light. Dealing with yellow pine and douglas fir.


Last edited by Jesse33; 11-20-2007 at 03:08 PM.. Reason: misspelling
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Old 11-20-2007, 03:29 PM   #2
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Is it a semi-transparent? or a solid stain?

I adjust the color of stain quite often trying to match gunstock flooring, while i am doing the stairs. I just use my eye and mix a little of this, and a little of that.

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Old 11-20-2007, 04:03 PM   #3
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Default how to darken stain

Sherwin Williams mixed the stain. It looks like transparent. It is definitely Min-Wax. Are there dyes one can add to stain?

Last edited by Jesse33; 11-20-2007 at 04:18 PM.. Reason: add text
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Old 11-20-2007, 07:35 PM   #4
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Try taking a piece of the old to the paint store to see if they could match the stain.
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Old 11-20-2007, 08:25 PM   #5
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I don't know if universal tints work in stain.
You could find out with a phone call, or just dump a tad of carbon black in the stain and give it a try...
Most stains darken with repetitive coats.
Also, as you probably know, the solids will drop out if can has been sitting on the shelf a long time...
Two points...
a) maybe the can sat a long time and was not mixed well?
b) use that settling to your advantage. Pour off the diluent from one can and spoon the solids out and add them to another can to be darker
...
I once bought a whole display of 86'd stain that was mostly unsaleable colors. All gallons and quarts. After it had set around for 6 months, I sat down with a few beers and opened them all, pouring them into 5's and stopped when tints began running out of the cans.
Then, I mixed all that recovered stuff with fresh product and oiled a log cabin. It came out great!
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Old 11-20-2007, 09:34 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesse33 View Post
Sherwin Williams mixed the stain. It looks like transparent. It is definitely Min-Wax. Are there dyes one can add to stain?
If it was "mixed", then it can be tinted
If it's Min-Wax, then no not really
Unless it was the Min-wax water-based stuff...that can be tinted
Are you talking the stuff you are using now?

If you are trying to match stain from 1967 there's no way to advise you from here
Christ it could be anything
Stain with shellac/varnish over it?
Even if you had the exact same can of stain, and the exact same can of varnish from 1967, and you put it over the exact same type of wood used in 1967, it won't match
The old finish is too well seasoned and the wood of today is different than the old wood...it'd look different

You may luck out mixing some stains, but it'd be pure luck... I'd suggest saving a ton of time, heartache, and money, and taking a sample of the old stained wood, and the new raw wood, to someone who can match it
If it's someone in a Paint Store or an antique furniture repair/refinisher
Pay them whatever...it's worth it

You may need to do some wacky steps to match it...like dying wood then staining, or staining then shellacking with a home-made shellac

There's just no way to tell over the internet
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Old 11-20-2007, 10:18 PM   #7
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So far that is more information than anyone has been willing to give me. Sherwin Williams had no clue how to mix the stain to start with and they called a painter who said the stain may have paint in it. They tried that but it didn't work.

The antique woodfinisher sounds like a good idea.
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Old 11-20-2007, 10:49 PM   #8
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I have had stain colored from ppg before while trying to match a decks. Has always turned out well.
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Old 11-21-2007, 07:31 AM   #9
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if you are using oil-based stain, then try to find Japan Colors,(not paint but heavy pigment) and add some to your stain.
Sounds like you need to stay away from a dye stain, and instead use a pigment, to achieve the look you want.
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Old 11-21-2007, 09:57 AM   #10
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Will that work for interior wood moldings and baseboards? and allow just a bit of the wood grain to show if you're looking at it close up.
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Old 11-22-2007, 08:03 AM   #11
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absolutely. we often use japan colors to help simulate aged wood ( like when matching new to old). one trick is to try and layer the color, rather than get it all on in one application. also you might need to varigate the coloring ( lights and darks) to help it match
www.RefinishNY.com
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Old 11-22-2007, 08:22 PM   #12
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Talking Playing with stain

Matching new wood to old wood - make a very strong hot tea and mix in ash from a wood stove and make a slury. Brush on new wood, wipe off, let dry. Stain over the top. It's called destressing. I did this on a library that was built 70 yrs. ago. The job was to match old stained oak to new oak and pine. It took me a good week to match both, two different stain formulas. Eight yrs. later still holding true. I had more cans of stain, pieces of wood and cans of gunk, felt like the mad scientest.
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Old 11-23-2007, 05:48 PM   #13
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I had new yellow pine doors that needed to match old heart pine trim.
I used half & half denatured alachol & umber shellac and then stained.
It made the doors looked destressed and matched well. Like Mari, I had several cans of stain and boards trying to get the match right.
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Old 12-06-2007, 10:48 PM   #14
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If you live in a metro area or near several SW stores. Call and find if any of them carry Sherwood stain concentrates (not dye concentrates). These are stains that are undiluted. Certain SW stores carry these and can do incredible stain matches! They would start out with an empty gallon add an appropriate amount of thinner (more thinner, lighter color, less thinner, darker color) then they shade it to the match. Most stores don't know about it or do it. Check around.
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Old 12-14-2007, 03:02 PM   #15
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Try a wiping stain (like Old Masters) instead of a penetrating stain. I have found that it offers richer finishes and a long open time, giving the user a lot of control. Some paint stores (usually independent dealers) will offer stain matches so long as you supply a piece of the old and a piece of the new.
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Old 12-16-2007, 11:42 AM   #16
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Lightbulb simple way to darken stain.

You already have the stain color you want on the other pieces of trim you are wanting to match to. Now you need to get the stain that is closest to what you need. Now get a stain that is one shade to dark. Now take the stain that is to light, and put a table spoon at a time of the stain that is to dark in the to light stain .Do this until you get the color you need... After each table spoon of darker stain used ,put a sample on a scrap piece of wood to test color.Keep doing this until you get the color you need.

Once you get the color you need, as you start your staining , just remember to keep stain mixed as you use, do to pigment will settle.

Also may i suggest to all the creative painters in our field to buy this book.

Creative Homeowners,Mastering Fine Decorative Painting Techniques. By Sharon Ross and Elise Kinkead at www.creativehomeowner.com
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Old 12-20-2007, 12:03 AM   #17
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What color are you trying to match?
The antique refinisher might suggest that a stain with analine dye was used. Particularly red. Analine dyes were used in an earlier time period but were probably still available in 1967. They may still be available. Something for you to check out. Perfect solution.

Merry Christmas.

Last edited by Joewho; 12-20-2007 at 12:17 AM..
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Old 12-21-2007, 07:10 AM   #18
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Did you ever figure this problem out? When matching old trim I like to use gel stains or dyes as a base. In many cases and depending on the age of the house it really isnt the darkness of the stain but the layers of varnish over the years that have aged. To simulate that look you have to build your finish in layers. I start with a good solid base of color which is at least 1/2 of the color when wiped. Then use a sanding sealer over it and when dry hit it with a 0000 steel wool. Next apply another coat of the gel stain to the surface but insted of taking it all the way down use cheesecloth and wipe over it leaving the recesses of the wood darker. Let dry for 48 hours and apply a sanding sealer 2 time and then marine varnish which does yellow.

If you'd like post pics of the project and I will help when I can. Wood work and furniture are a huge part of my business.

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