What would you do with this? - Page 2 - Paint Talk

CApainter · 02-08-2010, 11:14 PM

Wash em, scrape the loose paint , prime with oil, finish with acrylic. They will never pay you for the time it would take to refurbish them. More then likely, they'll be happy with the paint job and will understand why you couldn't guarantee them to last for an extended period of time. That's commercial.

Rcon · 02-09-2010, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CApainter

Wash em, scrape the loose paint , prime with oil, finish with acrylic. They will never pay you for the time it would take to refurbish them. More then likely, they'll be happy with the paint job and will understand why you couldn't guarantee them to last for an extended period of time. That's commercial.

I suppose you're right. I'll just have to wait for them to reply to my email and see what they want me to do with these, then go from there.

painterdude · 02-09-2010, 10:31 AM

sometimes you just have to do what they want. As you said, explain the right way and their way and what might happen. Not all of us can turn down work we think is not up to our standards. Some one man gangs need the dough. Do what you have to in this economy. Only you know your situation. pd

NCPaint1 · 02-09-2010, 11:56 AM

How do you plan on washing them now? Even if you do they wont dry anytime soon. Id take some 60-80 grit on a palm sander to the bad spots, shoot some heavy oil undercoat and finish with whatever you like. I've never done it, but maybe a block filler as a finish? It's pretty heavy, and can fill in some cracks. It wouldnt be the proper way to do these doors, but it may be the band-aid type fix they want.

Rcon · 02-09-2010, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NCPaint1

How do you plan on washing them now? Even if you do they wont dry anytime soon. Id take some 60-80 grit on a palm sander to the bad spots, shoot some heavy oil undercoat and finish with whatever you like. I've never done it, but maybe a block filler as a finish? It's pretty heavy, and can fill in some cracks. It wouldnt be the proper way to do these doors, but it may be the band-aid type fix they want.

Interesting, hadn't considered using a block filler - worth looking into.

I won't be doing this until mid-march if I get the job - it's been a warm winter but I don't risk exterior work in cold weather. Mid March is the earliest we start outside stuff.

johnpaint · 02-09-2010, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NCPaint1

How do you plan on washing them now? Even if you do they wont dry anytime soon. Id take some 60-80 grit on a palm sander to the bad spots, shoot some heavy oil undercoat and finish with whatever you like. I've never done it, but maybe a block filler as a finish? It's pretty heavy, and can fill in some cracks. It wouldnt be the proper way to do these doors, but it may be the band-aid type fix they want.

No man, no oil, you want something that is going to be flexible.Doors are like vinyl siding they move all day long.

Rcon · 02-09-2010, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnpaint

No man, no oil, you want something that is going to be flexible.Doors are like vinyl siding they move all day long.

Good point, and one of the main reasons I was looking at the hybrid solid stain - it's good and thick and would work well for this.

http://www.superdeck.com/Superdeck-P...ain/index.html

Picky Painter · 02-09-2010, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rcon

yeah, that's something along the lines of what I think these guys want. "Just want to clean it up a bit" was the term they used. I know a great product for this kind of work - an alkyd latex hybrid solid stain, good and thick so it'd at least hide some of that damage and prevent any wood tannins from bleeding through like it would just using an acrylic.

I'd like to know the name brand of that product Alec, if you don't mind.

Rcon · 02-09-2010, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Picky Painter

I'd like to know the name brand of that product Alec, if you don't mind.

Superdeck, there's a link in my last post to it, right above your post.

optimal · 02-09-2010, 04:22 PM

Just give them a good powers washing, followed up with a good scrape, i would spray and back brush some zinsser cover stain (oil), caulk some major gaps and follow up with 1 or 2 coats of some acrylic paint. Call it done

CApainter · 02-09-2010, 09:55 PM

I'm not sure a solid stain would work well on a previously 'painted' surface.

optimal · 02-10-2010, 10:19 AM

You must have never used the product; cover stain, it covers over stains. This product works wounders on stains and prepainted objects. It holds a bond to pratically anything. Try it some time.

johnpaint · 02-10-2010, 12:10 PM

Usually stain for homes is not much more than watered down paint, but it sounds like maybe cover stain has more resin in it than most stains. Basiclly just paint, sounds like it.

NCPaint1 · 02-10-2010, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnpaint

Usually stain for homes is not much more than watered down paint, but it sounds like maybe cover stain has more resin in it than most stains. Basiclly just paint, sounds like it.

Cover stain is an alkyd stain blocking primer, it is not a solid body stain. A solid stain is very similar to a flat paint but with no sheen ( yes the flats have some sheen ) It is not just a watered down paint....solid stains will work over previously painted surfaces, but work best on new wood because there is no sheen. This has been discussed on a different thread.

Back to RCON's question. Depending on how much they want to spend is what you should offer. Sounds like they want cheap band-aid fix. Understandable, that unit may sit empty for a while, so they dont want to invest a ton in new doors with no tenant. Maybe a quick wash, sand and like you said, 2 coats of a hybrid paint/stain...Sikkens RSF maybe? I just threw the Block Fill idea out there, never tried it....I dont see why it wouldnt work though. It could help hide some of the cracks and chips in the door.

CApainter · 02-10-2010, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by optimal

You must have never used the product; cover stain, it covers over stains. This product works wounders on stains and prepainted objects. It holds a bond to pratically anything. Try it some time.

Zinsser 'Cover Stain' is not intended as a finish coat. It essentially is an oil base primer. I hope your not using this product as a wood stain!

rcon is looking for an oil, or hybrid product he can quickly clean up the doors with. That's why he's considering solid stain. I was questioning whether solid stain, particularly oil, was recommended over a previously painted surface. NCpaint1 says Sikkens RSF would work. Are you caught up now?

Last Craftsman · 02-10-2010, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rcon

True enough. I just got the impression that they only wanted a quick job on this - something i'm not accustomed to doing.

But these aren't fluted columns and spiral staircases.

The only thing that potentially sucks about going with their request to just "clean them up a little", is it seems the more of a certain type of work one does, the more of that type of work one gets.

And if you don't enjoy doing 3 star commercial work, then you can lose enjoyment for what you do.

But there is nothing wrong with someone receiving a 3 star utility paintjob, and being charged fairly for a 3 star amount of work, it's just a different market.

Just so long as the doors are structurally sound, you aren't committing any foul by doing a 3 star job, and charging fora 3 star job if that is what they are asking for.

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And just so long as they understand that you provided them with a more expensive option that would have better aesthetics, your professionalism wont be hindered, not on a commercial job any way.

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If they go with the lower bid to just clean them up, then just do what you need to make sure the paintjob is sound, and the doors are protected from the elements, and don't worry about it.

Of course always make straight lines. Straight lines are required no matter what star job one is doing.

Last Craftsman · 02-10-2010, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NCPaint1

I just threw the Block Fill idea out there, never tried it....I dont see why it wouldnt work though. It could help hide some of the cracks and chips in the door.

I don't know, those doors flex a lot. Using a filler might be worse than none at all. I am open to the idea that there is a filler that would work though.

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I think if the doors are painted with good coverage, and lots of paint is worked into the chips, people probably wont be looking at the chips to much.

It really just depends on the caliber of the establishment whether it would hinder their image or not.

Rcon · 02-10-2010, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CApainter

Zinsser 'Cover Stain' is not intended as a finish coat. It essentially is an oil base primer. I hope your not using this product as a wood stain!

rcon is looking for an oil, or hybrid product he can quickly clean up the doors with. That's why he's considering solid stain. I was questioning whether solid stain, particularly oil, was recommended over a previously painted surface. NCpaint1 says Sikkens RSF would work. Are you caught up now?

Correct, I was looking for a solid stain to go over these. I don't want to use a paint because I can see that (without extensive prep) I would have peeling issues - not so with a solid hybrid stain. I've used the superdeck many times before, and though it is a pain in the neck to work with it does a pretty fine job on anything wood (flexible), even over a painted surface.

As for the Sikkens, I don't know what the SRD is, because we have no Sikkens dealers around here. We do have a small shop across the bridge that carries a few quarts of this or that Sikkens, but they don't carry quantity and their specialty is carpet and hardwood supplies so I doubt they'd have that - plus i'd rather not try something I am unsure of (never used before) on a job such as this.

I'm meeting the building owner in the morning to go over the details of what they want done with this (didn't meet them the first round), so I guess the interrogating email I sent them got their attention (they're coming in from another city). Hopefully this pans out, apparently if I get this part of the job, it turns out they're renovating the interior too when the lease is up and I could get that as well - plus it seems they own more properties ... this could be good...

Rcon · 02-11-2010, 02:20 PM

Well, I convinced them to replace the panels. Problem solved

aaron61 · 02-11-2010, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by optimal

Just give them a good powers washing, followed up with a good scrape, i would spray and back brush some zinsser cover stain (oil), caulk some major gaps and follow up with 1 or 2 coats of some acrylic paint. Call it done

Thats your answer,done 100's like that. It ain't the Taj Mahal