CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY, IT'S FREE!
Go Back   Paint Talk - Professional Painting Contractors Forum > Professional Painters > Green Painting Practices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-27-2012, 06:32 PM   #21
Painting Contractor
 
George Z's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Toronto
Posts: 2,138
Rewards Points: 1,042
Thanks: 2,002
Thanked 1,745 Times in 857 Posts
View George Z's Photo Album My Photos
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by degarb View Post
I think his opinion that Aura is crap is very valid.

I have spent about 10 grand trying various water borne alternative that could come close to the pop of the oil. Without revealing my product conclusion (based on 2005-2009 tests), I can reveal my overall concerns. Mainly, that the tougher and more glasslike the waterborne finish, the more impossible it will become to multicoat without fisheying. Also, whenever you sacrifice longevity for low voc, or lead disturbing, you have a false economy. Like, let us put polution controls to lower c02 by 10 percent and get a car that barely gets 1/3 gas mileage. (no c02 for refining, shipping and drilling?)
Your secret product findings aside.
"Sacrificing longevity for VOC" is not a quality but a social proposition.

I will not accept the quality argument.
There is no alkyd that will yellow less than acrylics,
in this case add colour lock and Aura wins the longevity game hands down.

Exterior: Alkyd in the sun fades in 2 years, especially dark colours (what longevity?)
Alkyd is way too rigid and will always crack more than quality acrylics.

But really, I don't want my guys to get that Impervo headache I have always had for years.
But mostly, I want my painters to have sweet dreams at night.
There are better causes to sacrifice our brain cells
than Mrs Smith's baseboards and spindles.


Last edited by George Z; 01-27-2012 at 09:25 PM..
George Z is online now   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to George Z For This Useful Post:
DeanV (01-29-2012), vermontpainter (01-29-2012)

Warning: The topics covered on this site include activities in which there exists the potential for serious injury or death. PaintTalk.com DOES NOT guarantee the accuracy or completeness of any information contained on this site. Always use proper safety precaution and reference reliable outside sources before attempting any construction or remodeling task!

Old 01-29-2012, 06:31 PM   #22
Senior Member
 
straight_lines's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Wilmington, N.C.
Posts: 7,128
Rewards Points: 2,188
Thanks: 4,917
Thanked 4,318 Times in 2,574 Posts
View straight_lines's Photo Album My Photos
Send a message via Yahoo to straight_lines
Default

Aura isn't crap. Not even close, its the best wall paint on the market for film build and color hide period. The fact its low voc is a plus.

Only time I have had fish eye issues is with clears. There are some pretty impressive wb enamels out there now, not as good as traditional oil but close.
__________________
JHC Armorcoat


Primer makes everything better...
straight_lines is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to straight_lines For This Useful Post:
George Z (01-29-2012)
Old 01-29-2012, 09:10 PM   #23
Paint to fish
 
DeanV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: MI
Posts: 7,840
Rewards Points: 2,092
Thanks: 784
Thanked 3,863 Times in 2,131 Posts
View DeanV's Photo Album My Photos
Default

Ditto to fisheyes in clears only. I have never had a wb paint fisheye without an obvious contamination.

Aura is pricey, but it still is a great product. We are very happy with the matte, although we are specifying more regal select lately.
DeanV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2012, 09:21 PM   #24
Senior Member
 
vermontpainter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 14,407
Rewards Points: 2,000
Thanks: 3,091
Thanked 5,917 Times in 3,426 Posts
View vermontpainter's Photo Album My Photos
Default

Oh me oh my, some folks really don't want to let go of oil.

Competence in waterborne is critical to painters who intend to stick around for another decade. Primers too.

I'm with George on this one. Oil finishes are nice. Waterborne finishes are nice. Save the brain cells.

This isnt about voc or epa. Its about working conditions and avoiding chronic issues.

The 10 minutes it takes me to clean a hvlp gun with thinner makes me just about puke. 25 years ago it was a great buzz.

All set with that. Its a much more practical life move to get good in things that involve water.

I wont even go into how good powder form crystalline silica is for us.
__________________
Scott

blog
vermontpainter is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to vermontpainter For This Useful Post:
palehorse222 (01-04-2014)
Old 01-29-2012, 09:25 PM   #25
Paint to fish
 
DeanV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: MI
Posts: 7,840
Rewards Points: 2,092
Thanks: 784
Thanked 3,863 Times in 2,131 Posts
View DeanV's Photo Album My Photos
Default

Isn't the silica in acrylic as much as oil???
DeanV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2012, 09:26 PM   #26
Senior Member
 
vermontpainter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 14,407
Rewards Points: 2,000
Thanks: 3,091
Thanked 5,917 Times in 3,426 Posts
View vermontpainter's Photo Album My Photos
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeanV View Post
Isn't the silica in acrylic as much as oil???
I believe that you won't find as much crystalline silica in anything as in oil based enamel.

Edit: Dean, I just checked msds, it is present in both 235 and 314.
__________________
Scott

blog

Last edited by vermontpainter; 01-29-2012 at 09:33 PM..
vermontpainter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2012, 06:20 PM   #27
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 449
Rewards Points: 250
Thanks: 566
Thanked 85 Times in 63 Posts
View Rick the painter's Photo Album My Photos
Default

We just did a Advance over Satin Impervo (White) trim job. I have to say i was thrilled with the results! The sills and windows look like glass.There were no doors,i know there will be a learning curve there.Congrats to Benjamin Mooore,Advance is killer!
Rick the painter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2012, 08:21 PM   #28
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 1
Rewards Points: 10
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
View paint manager's Photo Album My Photos
Default Advance

A great replacement for Satin Impervo Alkyd is the Advance Satin, Semi or High Gloss. Ask your local Benjamin Moore dealer for a sample.
paint manager is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2012, 09:14 AM   #29
Kev D.
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Newfoundland Can.
Posts: 91
Rewards Points: 75
Thanks: 3
Thanked 16 Times in 15 Posts
View finishesbykevyn's Photo Album My Photos
Default

What's interesting here, is that noone mentioned that he will probably have to prime that oil first to get superior results with the acrylic top coat. Now ,coming out with a Low VOC primer would be taking it one step further.. Even though they do say that 100% Acrylic will go over properly prepared oil, I just don't trust it..
finishesbykevyn is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-17-2012, 08:36 AM   #30
Painting Contractor
 
George Z's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Toronto
Posts: 2,138
Rewards Points: 1,042
Thanks: 2,002
Thanked 1,745 Times in 857 Posts
View George Z's Photo Album My Photos
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by finishesbykevyn View Post
What's interesting here, is that noone mentioned that he will probably have to prime that oil first to get superior results with the acrylic top coat. Now ,coming out with a Low VOC primer would be taking it one step further.. Even though they do say that 100% Acrylic will go over properly prepared oil, I just don't trust it..
Advance is not an acrylic, but an alkyd (oil).
We painted straight on Satin Impervo with it after lightly sanding it.
After the product cures it is very hard and durable.
George Z is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-29-2012, 06:02 PM   #31
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: new hampshire
Posts: 13
Rewards Points: 10
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
View ron e's Photo Album My Photos
Default

i agree aura is overpriced and hard to work with, lay it on tip it off and leave it alone don,t over brush this stuff
ron e is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2012, 10:26 AM   #32
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 3
Rewards Points: 10
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
View The paint tester's Photo Album My Photos
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by someresearch View Post
I currently have interior trim painted in Benjamin Moore's alkyd Impervo enamel. I am looking for a non-toxic or at least zero VOC (including zero VOC for the tint) paint.

Does anyone have any recommendations on a paint with similar leveling and flow characteristics, without the yellowing, and in a low/medium lustre finish? I want zero to minimal brush strokes. I want scuff protection so that the paint lasts. Eggshell does not provide enough scuff protection, and semi-gloss is not desired.

Most of the new non-toxic or zero VOC paints that I have seen are either not recommended for trim, or they do not come in a satin sheen. I am not concerned about price because we're only talking about a gallon or two.

Yes. I want my cake and I want to eat it too. Any recommendations?
only 1!! Muralo Ultra. levels like an oil, will not yellow, in 24hrs. you can sand to a powder. My advice from testing this product is such. Do NOT load it up like you would satin impervo..brush it on thinner, move faster, tip it off, and do not look back! if you happen to look back and see a sag...DO NOT touch it! It will have already set up and you'll do more to screw the finish up than help. Next day check and see if you can even "find" that sag. It truly levels so well you may not. If you do find it...use a good sanding block (extra fine or fine used many times) my favorite is by Webb Abasives, sand that sag out, apply your second coat. If you are spraying, FOG it on, or tack coat it (conventional or air assisted) airless, use the finest tip you can DBL attomizer, 207 etc...fog it on, stand back and watch what happens in as little as 10 min. the particles that look like orange peel flow out, join and dry down beautiful in 1 hour. Hit it again same way when it's dry to the touch. Try this over unsanded oil trim and try to scratch it off after just 5 days...most acrylics need 30 days to reach that hardness and even then will lift right off. This stuff holds on better than most primers I've used. I will say, my first spry job was as I have always done, nice even wet film, as I moved on around the piece I was spraying, the side I started was sagged to hell and back...Spoke to the rep and he said as I said above do not touch it, sand it lightly after 24 hours, and fog it on the next day...looked like lacquer! Forget Aura, thick like mud, overpriced, dries way to fast, (most acrylics do unfortunately).

Last edited by The paint tester; 03-14-2012 at 10:30 AM.. Reason: grammer, additions.
The paint tester is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-2013, 09:11 PM   #33
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 4
Rewards Points: 10
Thanks: 23
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
View Gumerk's Photo Album My Photos
Default

Ben Moore Advanced...the best trim paint I've used..."so far," doesn't yellow like oil, goes on smooth, dries fast, touches up easy, doesn't give me the buzzed feeling, but you have to watch the runs. BM Advanced seems to be a late runner, so where others are gonna run in 5-10 minutes BM Advanced seems to run in like 15-30 even...considering climate conditions. Cleans up with with water.

One thing from my experience I'd point out is if you want a certain finish go up one to get that finish comparable to oil. So, if you want a satin finish, get a semi gloss, semi gloss get a gloss etc.

I never want to use any other trim paint, unless something crazy better comes out.
Gumerk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-2013, 09:44 PM   #34
Senior Member
 
kdpaint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,400
Rewards Points: 550
Thanks: 693
Thanked 713 Times in 483 Posts
View kdpaint's Photo Album My Photos
Default

It does yellow in whites. It is great for some stuff. Takes too long between coats and has poor blocking, for how I like to do things at least. I'm really liking Ultraplate by California, and of course, Muralo Ultra. I get awesome results with both.
kdpaint is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2014, 07:13 PM   #35
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Poughkeepsie, NY
Posts: 12
Rewards Points: 10
Thanks: 1
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
View palehorse222's Photo Album My Photos
Default

I've found that BM Advance is the best for re-painting satin impervo, period. forget Aura unless your using a full coat of fresh start under it. I've put Aura Satin over Impervo and had a nightmare to fix. The finish just wouldn't bond, despite deglossing..At that time, I went back and primed it with fresh start (Advance was not yet available)..Is Advance readily available out west/mid-west? I didn't see anyone mention it. It is low-VOC, but not 0..if you want 0 maybe try Natura primer/Natura
palehorse222 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2014, 09:30 PM   #36
Senior Member
 
harmonicarocks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Bridgewater, VA
Posts: 219
Rewards Points: 158
Thanks: 107
Thanked 94 Times in 63 Posts
View harmonicarocks's Photo Album My Photos
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by someresearch View Post
I currently have interior trim painted in Benjamin Moore's alkyd Impervo enamel. I am looking for a non-toxic or at least zero VOC (including zero VOC for the tint) paint.

Does anyone have any recommendations on a paint with similar leveling and flow characteristics, without the yellowing, and in a low/medium lustre finish? I want zero to minimal brush strokes. I want scuff protection so that the paint lasts. Eggshell does not provide enough scuff protection, and semi-gloss is not desired.

Most of the new non-toxic or zero VOC paints that I have seen are either not recommended for trim, or they do not come in a satin sheen. I am not concerned about price because we're only talking about a gallon or two.

Yes. I want my cake and I want to eat it too. Any recommendations?
The Muralo Ultra products are low voc and the closest thing IMO to the oil base you want to replace. After curing, the hardness of Ultra is comparable to oil. You will want to use a little extender with it on the first coat, and not over-brush this product. The second coat is a little more tricky, and requires a little thinning with extender and a little water. It is available in a satin finish.
__________________
"That's my story, and I'm sticking to it." Collin Raye
harmonicarocks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2014, 09:45 PM   #37
RH
Moderator
 
RH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 10,854
Rewards Points: 2,426
Thanks: 7,106
Thanked 9,368 Times in 5,054 Posts
View RH's Photo Album My Photos
Default

Where's Bill when we need him?
__________________
"Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others."

Groucho Marx
RH is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to RH For This Useful Post:
slinger58 (01-05-2014)
Old 01-05-2014, 09:06 AM   #38
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Central MS
Posts: 2,683
Rewards Points: 2,098
Thanks: 5,267
Thanked 2,614 Times in 1,475 Posts
View slinger58's Photo Album My Photos
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RH View Post
Where's Bill when we need him?
In his recliner, sipping whiskey and laughing his a$$ off.
slinger58 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to slinger58 For This Useful Post:
RH (01-05-2014)
Old 01-05-2014, 09:12 AM   #39
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 115
Rewards Points: 75
Thanks: 233
Thanked 36 Times in 27 Posts
View bklynboy1970's Photo Album My Photos
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by slinger58
in his recliner, sipping whiskey and laughing his a$$ off.
Green alternative to BM Impervo enamel alkyd-image-979298125.jpg
bklynboy1970 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2014, 09:41 AM   #40
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 135
Rewards Points: 77
Thanks: 30
Thanked 71 Times in 32 Posts
View bbair's Photo Album My Photos
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by someresearch
I currently have interior trim painted in Benjamin Moore's alkyd Impervo enamel. I am looking for a non-toxic or at least zero VOC (including zero VOC for the tint) paint.

Does anyone have any recommendations on a paint with similar leveling and flow characteristics, without the yellowing, and in a low/medium lustre finish? I want zero to minimal brush strokes. I want scuff protection so that the paint lasts. Eggshell does not provide enough scuff protection, and semi-gloss is not desired.

Most of the new non-toxic or zero VOC paints that I have seen are either not recommended for trim, or they do not come in a satin sheen. I am not concerned about price because we're only talking about a gallon or two.

Yes. I want my cake and I want to eat it too. Any recommendations?
Farrow & Ball is probably the nicest paint I've ever seen and it's zero voc. I sprayed the high gloss on interior trim and it sprayed like oil and layed down even better. It's a pain to order though.

Sent from my iPhone using PaintTalk

bbair is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
SW ProClassic arylic/alkyd hybrid enamel JAPaint Surface Preparation and Application 72 02-10-2014 11:43 PM
Moorcraft Super Spec Urethane Alkyd Gloss Enamel Z22 johnpaint General Painting Discussion 1 02-09-2009 08:00 AM
My fun using BM Melamine (alkyd enamel low lustre) fungku Photos of Project and Equipment 13 07-08-2008 02:45 PM
Satin Impervo (alkyd enamel) Update slickshift Tools, Supplies and Equipment 6 12-28-2007 12:21 AM
Brushes for Alkyd Enamel slickshift Tools, Supplies and Equipment 9 12-13-2007 08:51 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:29 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2007-2014 Escalate Media LP. All Rights Reserved
Our Pro Sites Network
ContractorTalk.com | DrywallTalk.com | ElectricianTalk.com | HVACSite.com | PlumbingZone.com | RoofingTalk.com