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Old 10-17-2020, 05:53 AM   #1
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Default client wants flat white on walls and ceilings whole house?

what is the best for everything so I have no cutting in? i'm thinking pro mar 200 flat on everything or ultra spec flat. I guess my question is what would look better on a ceiling ben ultra flat or pro mar 200. I normally only use master hide or super hide on ceilings but no way will I use them on walls. thoughts? should i look into coronado? tia
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Old 10-17-2020, 06:19 AM   #2
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what is the best for everything so I have no cutting in? i'm thinking pro mar 200 flat on everything or ultra spec flat. I guess my question is what would look better on a ceiling ben ultra flat or pro mar 200. I normally only use master hide or super hide on ceilings but no way will I use them on walls. thoughts? should i look into coronado? tia
I definitely Wouldn't use US Flat on the walls. Atleast Regal Ulti Matte. Flat paint will not hold up. I would inform the client of this..
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Old 10-17-2020, 06:33 AM   #3
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I definitely Wouldn't use US Flat on the walls. Atleast Regal Ulti Matte. Flat paint will not hold up. I would inform the client of this..
In a perfect world I would use cashmere flat or regal but Its not in their budget. broke new homeowners.
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Old 10-17-2020, 06:59 AM   #4
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In a perfect world I would use cashmere flat or regal but Its not in their budget. broke new homeowners.
Hmmm... what colors will you be trying to cover? Also, do they have kids (especially younger ones) and pets? Just asking because if they are going flat white everywhere to save a buck then it may backfire on them.

Regardless, I would be sure to have a contract which specifically addresses these potential problems;

A. May need more coats than was bid for to get the coverage needed.

B. In a year or two they may be unhappy with how the finish is holding up in some areas (lack of cleanability) and you donít want them coming back at you because of it. Have them sign off on not holding you responsible for any issues associated with wear and tear.

C. They are ďbrokeĒ new homeowners. Youíll be happy you have a contract (donít forget a deposit clause) if there are any issues in getting paid.
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Old 10-17-2020, 08:27 AM   #5
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Regal flat. No cutting in? Iíve not heard of that. If it just means bashing the cover in the corners donít bother spending a lot on paint.


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Old 10-17-2020, 09:31 AM   #6
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Flat ceiling and walls, in one color, seems to be a standard application in the SF Bay Area. Particularly, in homes where a texture of some sort was applied. Kelly Moore 550 Interior flat was a standard all through the 80's and 90's and that was roughly the peak of Boomers having small kids.

With that said, you were likely subject to execution if you applied anything other than a semi gloss on trim. Even in the same color.
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Old 10-17-2020, 10:27 AM   #7
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Flat ceiling and walls, in one color, seems to be a standard application in the SF Bay Area. Particularly, in homes where a texture of some sort was applied. Kelly Moore 550 Interior flat was a standard all through the 80's and 90's and that was roughly the peak of Boomers having small kids.

With that said, you were likely subject to execution if you applied anything other than a semi gloss on trim. Even in the same color.
Ouch that's what my mom has in her house for 20 years. White dove regal flat and white dove impervo trim
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Old 10-17-2020, 12:53 PM   #8
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Ouch that's what my mom has in her house for 20 years. White dove regal flat and white dove impervo trim
My own home is painted in Kelly Moore Interior 550 Flat (Antique white) with matching semi gloss trim. lol

I think aesthetically, a monochrome color scheme, largely in flat with semi gloss trim, is driven by the following;

1. Textured walls lends itself to a replication of an Earthy, or natural textile. Dirt and rocks don't typically have a sheen in their natural state.

2. A monochrome palette allows the accessories in a space the room to emphasize their uniqueness without distraction, in the same way a dark solid color suit allows the smaller presence of the tie to project a particular message.

3. It's just a lot simpler to apply!
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Old 10-17-2020, 01:01 PM   #9
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My own home is painted in Kelly Moore Interior 550 Flat (Antique white) with matching semi gloss trim. lol

I think aesthetically, a monochrome color scheme, largely in flat with semi gloss trim, is driven by the following;

1. Textured walls lends itself to a replication of an Earthy, or natural textile. Dirt and rocks don't typically have a sheen in their natural state.

2. A monochrome palette allows the accessories in a space the room to emphasize their uniqueness without distraction, in the same way a dark solid color suit allows the smaller presence of the tie to project a particular message.

3. It's just a lot simpler to apply!
I think if you ran the first two by any average GC their response would be, ďHUH?Ē

On the third it would be, ďDUH!Ē
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Old 10-17-2020, 01:55 PM   #10
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I definitely Wouldn't use US Flat on the walls. Atleast Regal e Matte. Flat paint will not hold up. I would inform the client of this..
I would also explain to the customer that having very tiny bit of sheen from matte sheen paint on the ceiling is not a bad thing actually.
It will make light to bounce off the ceiling, instead of being trapped by the flat sheen surface.
It will make the ceiling (and walls) to have more 'life' to them, instead of dead flat feel.

That way you can keep the cost of labour to a minimum by using the same color and sheen paint on ceilings and the walls.
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Old 10-17-2020, 02:34 PM   #11
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I would also explain to the customer that having very tiny bit of sheen from matte sheen paint on the ceiling is not a bad thing actually.
It will make light to bounce off the ceiling, instead of being trapped by the flat sheen surface.

It will make the ceiling (and walls) to have more 'life' to them, instead of dead flat feel.

That way you can keep the cost of labour to a minimum by using the same color and sheen paint on ceilings and the walls.
Interesting.

Out here most ceilings, as well as walls, have texture - ceilings typically done in a light to medium knockdown. Iíve usually adhered to the idea that the less reflection off the ceiling the better since any flaws or irregularities in the texture will show up less when light is flooding across them from windows and such (repaired areas especially will show up unless the repair guy got a dead on match). The occasional times the ceilings are a smooth finish then the less reflective light there is seems to be even more beneficial.

Walls are most often done in eggshell or satin depending on the degree of wear and tear they will be subjected to and the HOsí preferences.
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Old 10-17-2020, 09:36 PM   #12
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Interesting.

Out here most ceilings, as well as walls, have texture - ceilings typically done in a light to medium knockdown. Iíve usually adhered to the idea that the less reflection off the ceiling the better since any flaws or irregularities in the texture will show up less when light is flooding across them from windows and such (repaired areas especially will show up unless the repair guy got a dead on match). The occasional times the ceilings are a smooth finish then the less reflective light there is seems to be even more beneficial.

Walls are most often done in eggshell or satin depending on the degree of wear and tear they will be subjected to and the HOsí preferences.
I totally understand the points you are making and I understand reasons why flat sheen paint is preferable, especially on flat ceilings to hide imperfections.
I mostly (95% of the time) deal with flat ceilings and flat walls.

My suggestion to OP was based on his statement that the goal is to do it on a budged, especially labour, to eliminate cutting.

I had couple of customers in the same situation, (light off white paint color), with the request to keep the labour cost down.
I suggested matte sheen on both ceiling and walls, explaining to the customer pros and cons of having bit of sheen on the ceiling, and matte on the walls being much better for potential cleaning than flat sheen.

Most people don't walk around with their heads up looking at the ceiling noticing imperfections. Assuming that the ceilings are in decent shape.
High end places different story of course, flat paint is used on ceilings.

For budget painting matte sheen on ceilings and walls is the best solution, in my opinion.
I hope OP will post back to tell us what he decided to do.
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Old 10-17-2020, 09:53 PM   #13
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If this is what they want I'd likely be trying to talk them into a Scuff-X matte. The matte is obviously not flat. Closer to an eggshell. But it's "relatively" flat, and for so many of the reasons already mentioned a basic flat white is fine for ceilings (and some closets), but rarely a good idea for anything else. Scuff-X stays clean better than other paints and cleans up easier than other paints. Brushes, rolls, sprays, and levels well. Dries fast.
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Old 10-18-2020, 06:39 AM   #14
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In a perfect world I would use cashmere flat or regal but Its not in their budget. broke new homeowners.
Funny how people say it's not in thier budget ,when upgrading to a better paint is the least of thier costs. Atleast go with an eggshell then. Or then again, who really cares if they're that cheap, you get get what you pay for I guess...There will still be some degree of cutting in regardless, as your roller is not going to perfectly get in all the edges and corners.
In those situations, I still quote it as any regular repaint.
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Old 10-18-2020, 09:14 AM   #15
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Kelly Moore 550 is really good flat paint. We did our tracts with that. One coat, no prime, no backroll. The drywallers would spray a prep coat before texture, though, which is why we could skip the backroll. on tracts where they didnt, we did backroll. Touched up perfectly, and never any adhesion problems. We would even use 550 to prime the trim.



PM 200 always has touch up problems. Ultra spec or speedhide doesnt.
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Old 10-18-2020, 10:09 AM   #16
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I would also explain to the customer that having very tiny bit of sheen from matte sheen paint on the ceiling is not a bad thing actually.
It will make light to bounce off the ceiling, instead of being trapped by the flat sheen surface.
It will make the ceiling (and walls) to have more 'life' to them, instead of dead flat feel.

That way you can keep the cost of labour to a minimum by using the same color and sheen paint on ceilings and the walls.
some say "life" others say streaky roller flashing.


if it was me i would just cut the tops of the house an off white so my clients arent living in a medical office, tell them you'll help them on this one but say "when you strike it rich remember the favor" and save the day.
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Old Yesterday, 05:49 PM   #17
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update: So now i'm thinking either pro mar ceiling paint on ceilings and walls or coronado super kote 5000 on lids and walls. I will report back, I only took this job because it will be empty and needs to be done before christmas.
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Old Yesterday, 06:33 PM   #18
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update: So now i'm thinking either pro mar ceiling paint on ceilings and walls or coronado super kote 5000 on lids and walls. I will report back, I only took this job because it will be empty and needs to be done before christmas.
I would go with Coronado for sure. Better product in my opinion.
Flat or low sheen.
https://www.benjaminmoore.com/en-ca/...interior-paint

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Last edited by IKnowNothing; Yesterday at 06:34 PM.. Reason: REMOVING VULGARITY ABOUT ShW paints...lol
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