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Go to interior paints for chemically sensitive clients.

6K views 30 replies 13 participants last post by  Woodco 
#1 ·
I know this has been brought up, but I'll throw this out there again. My GC just told me the client is chemically sensitive. We all know that VOC's have little to do with health stuff. I just want paint the says its health conscious on the label to make the client happy. I havent used either but Harmony from Slick Willy, and Natura from Benjamin Moore are the only ones I know of that are marketed for this. I'll probably just use Durapoxy on the trim, cuz thats the friendliest/healthiest trim paint I know of. Maybe this should be in the Green section, but Im posting here anyway.

Anything new out there?
 
#3 ·
I do pretty well with natura here. BM manufacturers this stuff on separate vats as to not cross contaminate. 0 complaints from the overly chemically sensitive people. You know the ones I mean. I had one lady stick her nose right in the can and take several deep whiffs (seriously who does this haha?) after complaining of headaches from using the color samples. It seems to also self level and the semigloss brushes out nicely.



I have been interested in bringing in some products from https://www.ecospaints.net/ in particular they make a zerovoc polyurethane I would like to try but havn't done so yet.
 
#5 ·
I was the lead painter for a seniors home job that needed there assisted living repainted all the time all year round when ppl moved out or moved on. We had to use harmony only so I have painted A TON with it.
Zero smell is the selling point for harmony along with zero VOC. Cut and roll like you would any latex, it preforms very average as paint. Doesn't cover the best, or lay down well so make sure to roll it out well.

It honestly isn't difficult to paint with though, just treat it as a latex, pole sand before rolling it out etc..

I used harmony in my nursy too just to keep the smell down. For me that is what I would choose
 
#9 · (Edited)
Well, today, I got into the garage and dug out all their paints. It was all Kelly Moore Green Coat. I was think ing cool, we dont need to switch paints... So, I called KM to see if they even have that product anymore, and they said no, but their 1010 line is as close to zero VOC as you can get, so, I think I will try to push for that, and try to explain that its mostly just a marketing ploy anyway. I'd just rather have a paint that says something on the label, just to avoid headaches with the client (no pun intended.)

I asked for a comparable product, but they didnt mention enviroplex.... I will look into that.

EDIT: I dont even see anything about enviro-plex online. Got a link?
 
#10 ·
I would definitely go with Natura or ECOS Paint because I have used both of those products in homes where people had severe reactions to any standard product including spackle or caulking. One client would get nose bleeds at least if you opened up a can of spackle, but we painted her whole basement walls ceilings and trim with Natura, and there was no problem.





One client had me do one door and jamb with ecos paint, and she wanted to live with it in her house for six months before she committed to me doing the other eight.
 
#11 ·
This summer I had a customer who was sickly the previous 12 months.

They removed the carpet, bought all new furniture, new drapes, etc.

They even went into the attic and removed everything to troubleshoot exactly what was causing him to be ill. He was still experiencing symptoms after the attic was re-insulated. The only variable left was the relatively fresh paint job 12 months earlier. I checked out the paint brand and it was Cloverdale 'Super eggshell' which is a relatively high VOC paint in Canada.

We re-painted everything including the doors, trim, and walls with BM Natura.

Guess what? That worked!

I don't know if it was psychosomatic or not, but repainting with Natura was the answer to a year of being sick. They were seriously considering selling the house before the repaint.
 
#12 · (Edited)
I want to stick with Kelly Moore, as its an insurance job, so Im not repainting every wall, just the ones that have been rerocked and textured. They had a hot water heater blow up, and the bottom four feet of sheetrock, and the base and casing on the ground floor are all being replaced, and Im only painting what needs to be painted. So, I wanted to stick to the same product as it will match the unpainted areas closer. Since Greencoat is no longer produced, I want to at least stick with Kelly Moore and hopefully, the sheens will match a little better. heres lots of higher walls Im not planning on painting, although if they want to pay me more to do it, great... Maybe I shouldnt try to match it so good..... I might get more work. Then again, if it matches perfect, it will save me a bunch of time. Also, Kelly Moore is as close to zero VOC as you can get. The government just wont let them advertise it that way anymore.
 
#13 ·
We had to use Harmony on a huge office complex that had over 3500 people in it, do to the maintenance departments request. Even though we couldn't really smell the product, they still had people complain that it made them sick, and of course, they were allowed to leave work for a day or two with pay.

They even had some employees who claimed they were allergic to dust before we even got to their department. How does one go through life if you allergic to dust?
 
#14 ·
On that note, I'll bet half of the people who claim they're 'sensitive to chemicals' are 'allergic to gluten' if you know what I mean. Thats why Im just concerned with what the label says. Maybe they should just market the paint as Vegan, and Gluten free, and double the price.
 
#15 ·
The funny thing is that the materials in "latex" paint that someone could actually have a reaction to or could be damaging to their health are odorless. So psychosomatic? YUUUUUUP! Especially if they are smelling the paint or think the odor is what is causing their problems. Best one is when they claim they can't use "latex" paint because they have a latex allergy. There is NO latex nor has their ever been actual latex in "latex" paint. EVER.

And especially women that use makeup. Because if the makeup isn't causing you to react, than there is nothing in "latex" paint you can react too. (I dated an environmental sciences major for 2 years once. She told me how the whole paint "reaction" crap was actually bull5it.)
 
#16 ·
I think that as contractors or Tradesman, we should be listening to the main concerns of our clients. We are present on our job to address what the client needs. I personally wouldn't go for the most simplest route, only because the paint store employee says that's what they have. When someone says they're sensitive to chemicals, I would look into real solutions.
Natura, or like product or...
I don't know about this product myself, but have you looked into this "Enviro-coat"
Http://staging.kellymoore.com/products/product-lines/1520
 
#19 ·
Sorry for the long delay. The product is called Enviro-Coat, not plex, and it is still available. I know because we just got updated pricing from Kelly Moore. It should be about $30-$35 a gallon for you, depending on your deal with your store. It is a great product, I would recommend over the 1010 line if youre wanting a better finish. I would imagine your rep makes more off the 1010 line than the 1510. If he wont give you a price on it, let me know and I will sell it to you.

Also, all of Kelly Moores labels have the VOC ratings printed on them. All of KM paints are very low VOC, and they use a low VOC colorant to keep everything down.
 
#20 · (Edited)
I called KM today again, and they said Envirocoat has been discontinued, and there is no alternative, so IDK. Anyway, I asked my GC to talk to the client to see if she would be okay with a regular "zero" VOC paint, or if she wanted to go with Natura, which is $20 more a gallon, which I would have to upcharge, and he said the first option would be fine. KM has some weird pricing for me. the Flat 1010 price is $25, but the Eggshell is $37. Thats a little skewed. BUT, the majority of the paint in this house is flat, so I will use that. I may go with Pure Performance for any eggshell, because it is "zero" VOC and says "Eco something or other" on the label, and I get that for about 10 a gallon cheaper. I'll have to do some math to see if its worth it. I did bid the job for $40 a gallon wall paint price, because I didnt know what kind of paints they used, so I can deal with KM's prices, but I think they are a little high, for the eggshell, especially when the Low Sheen is only $28 a gallon. Thats a little high for mid grade paint to me. I will be using Durapoxy for the trim for sure though.

Heres the price list for the KM 1010 line I was given today:

Flat $24
Lowsheen $28
Eggshell $37
SG $42

Seem a little off to anyone else??

Oh, The BM guys quoted me $60 a gallon for Natura. For that price, it better cure Asthma.
 
#21 ·
Hmm, Im not sure either then. Kelly Moore isnt good about communication stuff like that with us dealer stores. Last year we sold a large apartment complex job, 1000+ gallons of a particular paint and 100+ of several others. One of the smaller ones they started to reformulate (the new Epic) and stopped production of the old formulation. We sold that product thinking there would be no problem, only to have to drive around the state of Texas to many KM stores to get the last remaining stock to finish the job. Big fiasco, but oh well. The pricing you mentioned is in line with their suggested pricing, but you should be able to negotiate lower especially dealing with a company owned store vs independent dealer. Which Austin location do you use for KM?
 
#22 ·
Ok so I just got off the phone with my dealer rep and heres what he said. The Enviro-Coat is not being produced anymore, but there is still some in the system, but he wasnt sure if its at the new Hurst facility or the old California one. So you COULD get it if needed. He also mentioned taking "zero" VOC off the label because however long ago, several other companies were sued because once you add colorant, there is some VOC added. The 1010 line is labeled as >2g VOC/L, which accounts for the colorant to be added, meaning it is the closest to 0 you can get. Acry-Plex is also labeled as such. BMs Gennex colorants do claim to be 0 VOC post-tint, so if thats true, that may be the best way for this case. Thats a big price difference though.
 
#23 · (Edited)
I use the Kelly Moore on Victory Drive. I might use KM for the flat paint, but theres no way Im paying anywhere near 37 for mid grade eggshell, so Im going with Pure performance for that. I dont get it. There should NOT be a $15 difference between sheens. I had a price list before, and the prices were much closer together. IDK what happened.

I finally met the homeowner today. Theres a million different colors in this house. The ceiling paint I found didnt match, and I couldnt find the main beige color for the stairway, and 20' walls. Get this: She just had a friend haul off a whole bunch of other paint I didnt know about, and it just got recycled yesterday..... People are really, really stupid sometimes, and its gonna cost her a LOT of money to redo these high areas..... Now I might have to repaint a huge high ceiling and all the walls around it because the mold abatement team had to screw 2X4's with 6 mil plastic to block off the upstairs. But yeah, throw away the paint right before the painter is about to start and needs the colors... Oh well...
 
#30 ·
Natura ... not only zero VOCs, but zero emissions.

As for that crazy spread between sheens, isn't paint all glossy, then you flatten it down with talc??? Sure, I get there's more resin concentration in the higher sheens, but $15 between sheens. Normally, you see anywhere from $1 - $4 between sheens.
 
#31 ·
Well, with their professional line, I think they actually step up the paint quality with every sheen. Garbage flat, for 25, mid grade eggshell, and good quality SG, all in one line, which to be honest, isnt a bad way to do it, for tract homes anyway. The eggshell is too high though. And for three bucks more, you can get 1650 semigloss which is a really good product. Its about the best straight latex enamel I have used. I step it up to durapoxy for trim now though, if I use KM. Thats runs me about 46.
 
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