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Old 01-05-2019, 03:53 PM   #1
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Default New Barn/Commercial Kitchen - Breakthrough or Epoxy on concrete floor?

Hey everyone. We just finished the build out for a commercial barn with a 600 square foot commercial kitchen. Rules and regs for dept of health say the floor must be durable and easily cleaned.

The concrete was power troweled and beads water but no sealant was applied. We are considering doing a grind and then prime/epoxy, but the guy we use also said that Breakthrough is cheaper and durable/easy to clean.

Will cost us 2500 - 3k to epoxy and don't want to spend that kind of $ on 500 square feet but will if we have to. Would Breakthrough work good? Want to be able to clean oils/fats/dirt easily.

There is also radiant heat in the floor if it matters. Any recommendations are appreciated.
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Old 01-05-2019, 04:23 PM   #2
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Corotech V155 + V400 or V440. Optional urethane top coat. Bullet proof and last a lifetime. Breakthrough will hold up fine if you plan to recoat in the future. Whatever coating you choose you need to grind. Want the surface to feel like fine grit sand paper.


BTW most Epoxy isn't that expensive... roughly the same price as breakthrough. I don't believe breakthrough would be recommended for a kitchen area exposed to oil/fats/grease either.


Materials for primer and 2 coats 500sqft your only looking at ~$200

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Old 01-05-2019, 04:26 PM   #3
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I will check it out, thanks. Do you think the concrete needs to be grinded first with this?
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Old 01-05-2019, 04:42 PM   #4
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I will check it out, thanks. Do you think the concrete needs to be grinded first with this?

unless you like your floor coating to peel...
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Old 01-05-2019, 05:44 PM   #5
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Of course not, just making sure we do it right.
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Old 01-05-2019, 09:31 PM   #6
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unless you like your floor coating to peel...
Couldn't you just etch it with muriatic acid. Epoxy the way to go for sure in a kitchen. You'll probably want to be able to mop it up with ease. .. Breakthrough not gonna be anywhere close to an epoxy. .

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Old 01-05-2019, 09:33 PM   #7
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I thought about etching with muriatic but he said its a nightmare to work with and clean up. Its something i would consider doing myself as i have access to muriatic at a good price. How easy is it?
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Old 01-05-2019, 09:34 PM   #8
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Quote:
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unless you like your floor coating to peel...
Couldn't you just etch it with muriatic acid. Epoxy the way to go for sure in a kitchen. You'll probably want to be able to mop it up with ease. .. Breakthrough not gonna be anywhere close to an epoxy. .

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Etching is ok as long as the proper surface profile is reached and concrete is allowed to dry properly.
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Old 01-05-2019, 10:46 PM   #9
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If it were me I'd grind, use SW tide clad epoxy, then top coat with SW Rexthane. That system will last a VERY long time.

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Old 01-05-2019, 11:33 PM   #10
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Grind it and be sure. Acid etch works as part of the cleaning and tooth profile but you need to scarify the floor. You can grind a floor that small in a short period of time.
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Old 01-07-2019, 12:51 AM   #11
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Grind it and eliminate all doubt. Use any of the other mentioned products. Not breakthrough. It wont hold out nearly as well or nearly as long and will likely start peeling like a sunburn if /when water is introduced.


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Old 01-08-2019, 02:50 PM   #12
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Thanks so much for all the advice everyone.

I have done 2 small tests under the staircase. 1 with muriatic and the other with a seal krete product that claims the same results with less work.

Both sides went from being very smooth to being rougher with very little work.

I don't think the roughness is going to be enough as the floor is still smooth and when dropping water on the spots I etched the water doesn't pool like on the untested floor, but spreads out a lot more (it doesn't absorb in quickly like I read it should do after acid etching).

I have a rep from Ben Moore coming tomorrow morning to look at the floor before we do anything or decide on a final product but we are leaning toward V440 as recommended by Coco.

I can rent a machine to grind it this weekend, but its not something I have ever done before. I don't want to make a mess so I think I should wet it first. Do you have any recommendations as to the proper things I should buy to help me grind it the right way? Is there anything specific I need to do or buy?

If I etch the floor myself it will make it much cheaper for the painter to come in and do his job.
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Old 01-08-2019, 04:02 PM   #13
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Quote:
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Thanks so much for all the advice everyone.

I have done 2 small tests under the staircase. 1 with muriatic and the other with a seal krete product that claims the same results with less work.

Both sides went from being very smooth to being rougher with very little work.

I don't think the roughness is going to be enough as the floor is still smooth and when dropping water on the spots I etched the water doesn't pool like on the untested floor, but spreads out a lot more (it doesn't absorb in quickly like I read it should do after acid etching).

I have a rep from Ben Moore coming tomorrow morning to look at the floor before we do anything or decide on a final product but we are leaning toward V440 as recommended by Coco.

I can rent a machine to grind it this weekend, but its not something I have ever done before. I don't want to make a mess so I think I should wet it first. Do you have any recommendations as to the proper things I should buy to help me grind it the right way? Is there anything specific I need to do or buy?

If I etch the floor myself it will make it much cheaper for the painter to come in and do his job.

If you are going to etch: give at least 48 hours to dry. You can use the V440 by its self however the system I would use:
1) V155 epoxy pre-primer
2) V440 Waterborne Amine epoxy
3) v540 Waterborne urethane topcoat



Get a written spec from your BM rep!
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Old 01-08-2019, 09:20 PM   #14
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Grinding is super easy to do. Go to you local rental center and pick up a single head grinder. You'll also have to buy blades there are a couple different types but the guy at the rental center will show you what you need. They all have a shroud and a port for a vacuum attachment. Use a shop vac, the hose should fit the port. When you're done shop vac the entire floor real good. I'd figure having the floor ground and cleaned in no more than four hours.

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Old 01-08-2019, 10:36 PM   #15
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Just as a friendly service announcement to our valued members and the OP, please be advised that this thread has been allowed to continue because of the interest and value that it adds.
Normally, as a DIY topic started by a person outside the profession of painting, it would be redirected to our sister site.
I'm saying this to avoid any issues from members and to advise the OP that in the future, dont be surprised if a redirect is offered before any responses. One of the parameters of joining this particular site is the direct involvement in the painting industry specifically. Just an FYI. No Ill will intended, just information for a later time.

I'll post the redirect for informational purposes only and leave the thread open.


Thanks for posting on PaintTalk.com. The Moderators of this forum would prefer that you post Do It Yourself related topics on our sister site www.DIYChatroom.com .

PaintTalk.com is designed for professional painting contractors and the related fields to discuss issues and topics pertaining to the painting industries. Many of our professional contractors are also members at DIYChatroom.com and are looking forward to assisting you with your needs.

Please take a moment to post your question at www.DIYChatroom.com If you're not already a member of DIYChatroom.com you can sign up for a free account by going to http://www.diychatroom.com/register.php .

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Old 01-09-2019, 09:20 AM   #16
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I completely understand, but I was under the impression this forum was for contractors. I am a GC as you can see in my profile and came here for help on how to coordinate with one of my painters on products I have never used. I have tons of experience with standard paints but have never done a floor.
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Old 01-10-2019, 12:10 AM   #17
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Understood
Out of curiosity have you checked out our other sister site "contractor talk"? Another great resource to add to the list!
Hope your project goes well.

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Old 01-10-2019, 12:34 AM   #18
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Please post before/after pictures
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Old 01-11-2019, 09:06 AM   #19
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What is going to be done in the kitchen? Commercial kitchen used for busy restaurant type daily food prep? Or residential kitchen with family meal prep? If prepared properly, epoxy floors become part of or “in”the concrete, as Breakthrough would effectively be “on” the floor. Check moisture content, pH, where curing compounds used? Does water bead up or absorb on the floor? Grinding and a three coat system that has been suggested is the best system. You can even broadcast a colored aggregate for aesthetics and and slip. Adds tensile and compression strength too. Breakthrough would be a quick system that would require annual maintenance especially if its a busy heavy use commercial kitchen. Acid wash is old school and is very inconsistent, challenging to workers, needs to be neutralized, and requires days of dry time.
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Old 01-11-2019, 09:29 AM   #20
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I used to sell tons of epoxy floor coatings to Jiffylube in Socal. Imagine what those floors go through. (we were selling a product called Phillyclad at the time.) The contractor found out the hard way that the prep was absolutely crucial for the system to hold up properly. Follow the directions recommended above. Or you may have a nightmare trying to fix it. Moisture content and PH level are absolutely critical as well. These two thing are the reason i refuse to sell DIY garage floor coatings. DIY customers never do the proper prep, and the paint manufacturer is only liable for replacing the paint IF the prep is done correctly. And then all they have to do is replace the paint. Leaving a HUGE and expensive labor expense for someone else to pay for.
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