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Old 03-25-2019, 06:11 PM   #1
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Default Should re-prime a drywallerís bad attempt at priming drywall?

Iíve got a job where the drywallers applied a coat of cheap Hamilton PVA primer in a basement. They fogged it on, didnít backroll it and a few areas had almost no primer.

The walls will Scuff-X Matte and UltraSpec 500 flat ceilings.

Iím torn if I should re-prime the walls with PPG 6-2 or leave it as-is.






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Old 03-25-2019, 06:52 PM   #2
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Yes you should reprime.
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Old 03-25-2019, 07:17 PM   #3
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You SHOULD reprime, but I probably wouldnt. I think two topcoats would probably be okay. Is it high end?
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Old 03-25-2019, 07:25 PM   #4
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Depends on the budget and what HO is willing to pay for. If they will pay the cost of the primer than I'd do it. If they want to gamble the bad prime, let them. It's the HO's call.
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Old 03-25-2019, 07:46 PM   #5
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Tell the drywallers to come back and finish the job properly..?
I hate it when the drywallers do the priming. I be like, just leave it to the professionals.

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Old 03-25-2019, 08:07 PM   #6
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Pretty hard to screw up priming... they should be pleased.
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Old 03-25-2019, 09:43 PM   #7
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My best friend owns the house, so I can pretty much do whatever I want on this job.

I knew that pretty much everyone would re-prime and I wanted to as well. I just didnít want my friend to think I was taking advantage of him without asking others for their opinion.

I specifically told him not to have the drywallers prime the drywall, but they hoodwinked him by saying they like to prime because it makes easier to see flaws so they can fix them before they finish.




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Old 03-25-2019, 10:24 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by PNW Painter View Post
My best friend owns the house, so I can pretty much do whatever I want on this job.

I knew that pretty much everyone would re-prime and I wanted to as well. I just didnít want my friend to think I was taking advantage of him without asking others for their opinion.

I specifically told him not to have the drywallers prime the drywall, but they hoodwinked him by saying they like to prime because it makes easier to see flaws so they can fix them before they finish.
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That was a true statement by the drywaller/tappers. They are not looking for a great primer finish, the primer DOES make it easier to see what was not finished well on the taping. Most do not do great primer work, So, YES, prime it properly. You might save your "friend" world of pain down the road!

I don't think they so much hood-winked him as they did THEIR part honorably. (Assuming the dings and divots were properly filled and sanded when they were done).
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Old 03-25-2019, 10:45 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jennifertemple View Post
That was a true statement by the drywaller/tappers. They are not looking for a great primer finish, the primer DOES make it easier to see what was not finished well on the taping. Most do not do great primer work, So, YES, prime it properly. You might save your "friend" world of pain down the road!

I don't think they so much hood-winked him as they did THEIR part honorably. (Assuming the dings and divots were properly filled and sanded when they were done).

I heard this exact same story from a guy who had his drywallers prime with a PVA recommended by a professional painter/friend. Drywall guys swore up and down they did level 5. 4 coats of scuffx later you could still see the seams. Of course it must be the paint fault LOL.


Long story short I ended up comping him some materials to fix the mess but a good primer and a straight edge would have shown it in fact was not level 5 in the first place.
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Old 03-25-2019, 10:58 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by cocomonkeynuts View Post
I heard this exact same story from a guy who had his drywallers prime with a PVA recommended by a professional painter/friend. Drywall guys swore up and down they did level 5. 4 coats of scuffx later you could still see the seams. Of course it must be the paint fault LOL.

Long story short I ended up comping him some materials to fix the mess but a good primer and a straight edge would have shown it in fact was not level 5 in the first place.

"Professional Drywall Company", no doubt!

I hate it when any trade refuses to accept responsibility. Hard to believe but my major asset was ALWAYS the "MEA CULPA & I"LL MAKE IT RIGHT!" The ability to take responsibility is a big winner with the HOs and PAID HELP!
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Old 03-26-2019, 01:08 AM   #11
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I said the drywallers hoodwinked my friend because priming drywall is an easy way for them to make some extra $$$ on a job. Plus, they donít have to deal with repercussions that using ultra cheap PVA and poor coverage has on a job:
- You use more paint because cheap PVA doesnít seal the drywall very well.
- Touch ups end up being glossy spots because youíre still building sheen, even after applying two coats on the walls.

Some people have to learn the hard way. My friend is self GCíing this project, so heís having to learn the hard way in some instances.

Iíll find out how much the drywallers charged to prime everything. Iím sure Iíd charge more to do it, but Iíd also backroll it, use a better primer (PPG 6-2) and get even coverage everywhere.

The situation just pisses me off. At the end of the day I have a massive amount of pride in my work and I want to do the best job possible.


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Old 03-26-2019, 01:46 AM   #12
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@PNW Painter Being one's own GC, especially for a person who has not done a lot of subbing, (worse if not a tradesman) the learning curve can be both painful and expensive, especially if they are contracting based on price, alone. (As we all know cheapest is RARELY best!)

If the drywallers were low end on price your friend probably got all that he paid for. Do yourself a favor and just do your own job the same as you would for any other GC. If HO is GC then they need to accept responsibility for the trades he hires and you need to avoid ulcers over problems that are NOT YOUR RESPONSIBILITY!

Good Luck & I hope the Friendship Survives the contract!
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Old 03-26-2019, 06:54 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW Painter View Post
My best friend owns the house, so I can pretty much do whatever I want on this job.

I knew that pretty much everyone would re-prime and I wanted to as well. I just didnít want my friend to think I was taking advantage of him without asking others for their opinion.

I specifically told him not to have the drywallers prime the drywall, but they hoodwinked him by saying they like to prime because it makes easier to see flaws so they can fix them before they finish.




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If it's your best friend I would most definitely re-prime, you wouldn't want him to become your former best friend now, would you?
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Old 03-26-2019, 07:20 PM   #14
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If it's your best friend I would most definitely re-prime, you wouldn't want him to become your former best friend now, would you?
Right from the beginning my impression was that that was a troll thread.
I was watching how many will fall for it.
If it was for a friend of course you would do it, even put a coat of sealer for free if friend refuses to pay for it.
Be a real friend and tell him, it's a gift.
I still think it's a clever troll thread tho,lol.
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Old 03-26-2019, 09:19 PM   #15
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Nope, not a troll thread. I just wanted confirmation from other painters that re-priming was the way to go.

Weíve been best and closest friends since we were 4. We talked about it today and heís cool with re-priming everything. Heís actually looking forward to helping me with the painting.


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Old 03-27-2019, 11:14 AM   #16
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Jennifer is correct. I believe the tapers were being honest when they suggested a coat of primer would help identify areas needing further attention.


As far as applying another coat of primer over the top of the PVA sealer? I'd look at it like this:


1. A true PVA Sealer is a treatment that is compatible with the high alkalinity of a bare, (finished taped) drywall surface. It is not designed for leveling or sheen holdout.


2. Subsequent coats of self priming paints and or primers designed for better sheen holdout, is typically a common option for a coating system.


3. Some high build primers offer a combination of high alkalinity compatibility, and sheen hold out.


4. If the primer was designed for high build, high alkalinity, and sheen hold out, I would hold the taper accountable for a second coat of the same primer.


5. If the primer they applied was intended to be a simple PVA Sealer (Poly vinyl Acetate) treatment and not a Poly Vinyl Acrylic, I would definitely recommend applying a primer that was designed for build and sheen holdout. Unless the finish is going flat. Then I'd just apply a self priming flat. Maybe a couple coats at best.
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Old 03-27-2019, 11:24 AM   #17
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Unfortunately, I donít know exactly which primer was used. The HO thought it was a Hamilton product.

What I can say is that the primer has no sheen and feels like drywall mud.


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Old 03-27-2019, 11:34 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW Painter View Post
Unfortunately, I donít know exactly which primer was used. The HO thought it was a Hamilton product.

What I can say is that the primer has no sheen and feels like drywall mud.


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The true PVA Sealers I've used in the past tended to be semi transparent and had a thin DFT. Sometimes, it would feel a little grainy where it slightly raised the paper on the drywall.


If the tapers charged your friend for a paint ready surface, they would and should have used something marketed as a PVA/High build with good sheen hold out.


Zinsser actually states on their "Drywall" primer, to use Waterborne 123 over the initial primer for better sheen holdout. (Not certain if it was actually over, or in place of)
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Old 03-27-2019, 11:37 AM   #19
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Of course, Footloose..I mean futtyos, would obviously recommend GARDZ. But I think he bathes in it. So not certain that can be qualified.
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Old 03-27-2019, 11:46 AM   #20
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Iíve got a job where the drywallers applied a coat of cheap Hamilton PVA primer in a basement. They fogged it on, didnít backroll it and a few areas had almost no primer.

The walls will Scuff-X Matte and UltraSpec 500 flat ceilings.

Iím torn if I should re-prime the walls with PPG 6-2 or leave it as-is.

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I agree that the tapers need a white coat to be able to point up the surfaces, but in my opinion they did put on an inferior product as a first coat of anything, namely cheap PVA, and they put it on in such a manner that it might not provide a base coat that will allow the top coats to properly adhere to the surfaces.

If this was something I was encountering I would put a coat of Gardz over the whole mess as Gardz is much thinner than a pigmented sealer/primer and will soak through the cheap PVA and bind it (as well as any residual dust) to the ceilings and walls, leaving you (and your best friend) with sound surfaces upon which to apply top coats.

They say you only get one chance at first impressions, but Gardz can soak through that first PVA impression and maybe save potential problems from occurring in the future. I may be wrong, but I doubt that any pigmented sealer will soak through the PVA like Gardz will. If you want to test and see what Gardz will do, try rolling half a small wall that has good lighting. If the surface was sealed you probably will not see any darkening of it when Gardz is applied. If the surface the PVA is on is porous, the Gardz will make the suface darker just like water will make a white t-shirt several shades darker where the t-shirt gets wet.

Good luck,

futtyos
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