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Old 06-13-2018, 09:51 PM   #1
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Default SW Kem-Aqua?

New wood cabinets installed, primed, sanded, sprayed first coat of Kem-Aqua with a FFLP airless tip 310. The product according to SW has issues when applied to vertical surfaces. The product will run if too heavy a coat even slightly. However a representative from Sherwin Williams having been called to to the job stated using a larger tip and an extender might solve the problem. Even using the FFLP adjusted to the right pressure and holding the gun away from the surface hasn't been solved the run problem completely. It added a dusty feel on the surface. So I'm not sure what direction to go next.

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Old 06-13-2018, 10:58 PM   #2
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Im not familiar with the product, but I will say that the SW rep doesnt know squat about spraying, so dont listen to them. Wait for people on here.

Personally, I would try a 410. It spits the same amount of paint out, spread over a wider distance, so its a finer spray overall. A little extender is good, because it lets the paint flow when you spray less on the surface.

A technique I often use for lacquers is to double wet coat, using very fast vertical motions, spraying less on each pass, and a LITTLE slower moving horizontally, rather than trying to get a full coat at once, if that makes sense...
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Old 06-14-2018, 02:35 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by Woodco View Post
Im not familiar with the product, but I will say that the SW rep doesnt know squat about spraying, so dont listen to them. Wait for people on here.

Personally, I would try a 410. It spits the same amount of paint out, spread over a wider distance, so its a finer spray overall. A little extender is good, because it lets the paint flow when you spray less on the surface.

A technique I often use for lacquers is to double wet coat, using very fast vertical motions, spraying less on each pass, and a LITTLE slower moving horizontally, rather than trying to get a full coat at once, if that makes sense...
Yes it does, thanks.

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Old 06-14-2018, 03:11 AM   #4
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Going to a bigger tip and pulling the gun further away doesnít make any sense. A 308 FFLP tip would help. Air movement also helps, turn on a few box fans after youíre finished spraying. Raising the room temp to the high 70ís would also help.

I havenít used Kem Aqua Plus, but I have sprayed the pigment and clear version of SWís HydroPlus. The performance characteristics are very similar to Kem Aqua Plus. The clear was very easy to spray and I didnít have any issues with runs. The pigmented version is much thinner. Itís possible that switching to HydroPlus might solve some of your issues.


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Old 06-14-2018, 08:48 AM   #5
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Guys, i'm not going to tell you why, but i'm getting quite a chuckle from reading this thread. Has to do with something that happened to one of my customers and not the product.
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Old 06-14-2018, 11:07 AM   #6
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Waterbornes of this formulation cannot be applied to the same wet mil thickness as solvent based lacquers. A smaller diameter tip is called for (310 is fine) but you can only apply these to about 1 1/2 wet mils per coat.
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Old 06-14-2018, 11:56 AM   #7
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I haven't used KA yet but some have suggested doing a quick tack coat first and coming back a few minutes later with a full coat.

Using an extender seems to be counterproductive. That extends the open time and thus will increase the runs. Do thinner coats. There is a learning curve when using these waterborne coatings. They can be very finicky to use.

Painters and woodworkers have complained about these coatings for years and they still aren't widely used.
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Old 06-14-2018, 12:40 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Cusingeorge View Post
Waterbornes of this formulation cannot be applied to the same wet mil thickness as solvent based lacquers. A smaller diameter tip is called for (310 is fine) but you can only apply these to about 1 1/2 wet mils per coat.
Yup! Lighter coats, that's the ticket!
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Old 06-14-2018, 12:42 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Smith View Post
I haven't used KA yet but some have suggested doing a quick tack coat first and coming back a few minutes later with a full coat.

Using an extender seems to be counterproductive. That extends the open time and thus will increase the runs. Do thinner coats. There is a learning curve when using these waterborne coatings. They can be very finicky to use.

Painters and woodworkers have complained about these coatings for years and they still aren't widely used.


well they were engineered to be OEM paints sprayed through conventional or conventional HVLP equipment so...... "The sign out front should have told you."
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Old 06-14-2018, 02:48 PM   #10
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I have used KA+ pigmented through turbine hvlp. Just have to do light coats. No such thing as one and done. I typically do three coats sanding between coats 2 and 3. I also run HVLP on stage 2 so even with HVLP you have to dial it back. On horizontal surfaces you can put it on a little heavier and it will float out. Vertically you are limited to about 3 mil wet at best. Horizontal about 4 mil wet. One of the learning curve issues with KA+ is that it doesn't run right away. About the time you think you have it dialed in you look back and see curtains. At 2-4 min is when it seems run. You can touch it with a brush but rarely is it an isolated run. Hope this helps...
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Old 06-14-2018, 11:17 PM   #11
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I have used them, waterbase lacquers, with mixed results on vertical.


What was your indoor temp? It needs to be very warm, like 78 or higher. If it is too cold the product will not dry quickly like lacquer should and will run.
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Old 06-14-2018, 11:39 PM   #12
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I have only had issues with WB lacquers running when I get to much build up in an area (usually around cabinet corbels or detailed areas). With an airless I would step down to a 308 tip, but I have since switched to an HVLP for clear coats.

If you havent noticed already the WB lacquers are very thin, I was able to shoot them out of a gravity feed hvlp without any thinning. There is definitely a learning curve with these products, much different than pre-cats. I never got "finished" results from two coats, always three with sanding between the 2nd and 3rd coat. I would start with a fog coat, then apply a second, sand, then lay your finish coat.

Try spraying some sample vertical pieces. Check that your not overlapping too much and make sure the coat before is completely dry before apply another.
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Old 06-15-2018, 08:44 AM   #13
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Quote:
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I have only had issues with WB lacquers running when I get to much build up in an area (usually around cabinet corbels or detailed areas). With an airless I would step down to a 308 tip, but I have since switched to an HVLP for clear coats.

If you havent noticed already the WB lacquers are very thin, I was able to shoot them out of a gravity feed hvlp without any thinning. There is definitely a learning curve with these products, much different than pre-cats. I never got "finished" results from two coats, always three with sanding between the 2nd and 3rd coat. I would start with a fog coat, then apply a second, sand, then lay your finish coat.

Try spraying some sample vertical pieces. Check that your not overlapping too much and make sure the coat before is completely dry before apply another.
With these types of products it is always better to do an extra thin coat then try to get by with fewer coats. Quite similar to how you get a nice even finish with automotive paints. If you want to blow on two coats and be done with it you pretty much need to stick with the true architectural paints. If you are using the high end paints you should be willing to do whatever it takes to get the maximum performance out of them, and using thinner coats is the best way to do that.
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Old 06-15-2018, 10:57 PM   #14
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I've used Kem Aqua + clear coat. Ran through conventional airless, 312 FF graco tip (old style, not new FFLP). Worked fine for me. No runs, great finish. It's a stout product in my book. If I didn't know of and use stronger/better products I'd spec it in for my projects for clears.

Try the LP tip. Extender helps too if it's a hot environment. You'll get dry spray if you go too fast too far away. More like dusting the surface instead of laying it on. In the summer times when using lacquers we have to use extenders so we don't get spider webbing or white flashes. It does help, try a 10% reduction at first, see what happens.
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Old 06-17-2018, 02:43 PM   #15
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I've used Kem Aqua + clear coat. Ran through conventional airless, 312 FF graco tip (old style, not new FFLP). Worked fine for me. No runs, great finish. It's a stout product in my book. If I didn't know of and use stronger/better products I'd spec it in for my projects for clears.

If you donít mind sharing what are some of the stronger/better clears that youíre using?



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Old 03-01-2020, 09:33 PM   #16
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Does anyone have experience rolling on Kem Aqua? I’m considering using it on a cabinet project where the doors will be sprayed but for the cabinets themselves spraying is not possible.
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