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Old 07-01-2013, 01:58 AM   #81
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This is one reason I wouldn't wanna work for many painters.

You can't provide brushes for help that makes you money?

I guess I don't need to ask about any dental or medical either.
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Old 07-01-2013, 06:03 AM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hines Painting View Post
Where on earth are you finding a quality brush for $8?

And, who on earth spends 30 minutes cleaning 1 brush?

I guess that's what $8 brushes gets you?

I know if you search the interweb thingy you can find a case of 24 Purdy 2 1/2" for under $10.00 each, the 3" roughly $12.00. You will never get these case prices in the paint store. After seeing that post I started looking around and may buy a case just for myself, hmmmm maybe I can just rent then to the employees, a buck a day, 5 bucks a day if they don't clean them or clean them right.
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Old 07-01-2013, 06:58 AM   #83
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This is one reason I wouldn't wanna work for many painters.

You can't provide brushes for help that makes you money?

I guess I don't need to ask about any dental or medical either.
Day one, employee uses your paintbrush, day 2 paint brush is stiff because employee did not clean it properly. Day 3, employees buys his own paintbrush. Are you getting my drift?

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Old 07-01-2013, 07:52 AM   #84
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We have 40 painters and paint supervisors and we supply every tool including all carpentry tools. If you have a favorite duster or 5 n 1 then bring it to work. Leave every other tool that you own at home.
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Old 07-01-2013, 08:31 AM   #85
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We have 40 painters and paint supervisors and we supply every tool including all carpentry tools. If you have a favorite duster or 5 n 1 then bring it to work. Leave every other tool that you own at home.
Have you ever estimated, how much money you lose per year doing all of the above?
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Old 07-01-2013, 08:54 AM   #86
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This is one reason I wouldn't wanna work for many painters.

You can't provide brushes for help that makes you money?

I guess I don't need to ask about any dental or medical either.
Can you provide dental and medical insurance for yourself or any of your employees? If you have or had any?
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Old 07-01-2013, 09:49 AM   #87
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This is an argument that will live as long as the profession.

It is true that people will take better care of their own tools than company tools - that just seems to be human nature.

One "compromise" I heard was that the company bought the first brush, it it got lost, abused, or unfit to use do to neglect - the employee paid for a new one. Same true with small hand tools.

The problem with forcing your employees to buy their own brushes and such is they may very likely buy cheap sub-standard tools and waste more time than the tool is worth. But then again, no company should allow the wanton loss of tools. The company can buy good brushes in bulk and save the employee some money on replacement


Larger more expensive tools were supplied by the company. You can make up your own rules on them to discourage abuse.

In a larger company, instead of having many employees trying to wash their brushes out at the same time, appoint a brush cleaner for the day. While the other equip is being put away for the day, one guy cleans the brushes. It's a rotating job. I only had 3 - 5 workers and that worked well. One brush should take no longer than five minutes. I wash out brush, sleeve, tray and cut pot in 5 - 7 minutes. (waterborne)



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Old 07-01-2013, 10:09 AM   #88
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Originally Posted by daArch View Post
This is an argument that will live as long as the profession.

It is true that people will take better care of their own tools than company tools - that just seems to be human nature.

One "compromise" I heard was that the company bought the first brush, it it got lost, abused, or unfit to use do to neglect - the employee paid for a new one. Same true with small hand tools.

The problem with forcing your employees to buy their own brushes and such is they may very likely buy cheap sub-standard tools and waste more time than the tool is worth. But then again, no company should allow the wanton loss of tools. The company can buy good brushes in bulk and save the employee some money on replacement

Larger more expensive tools were supplied by the company. You can make up your own rules on them to discourage abuse.

In a larger company, instead of having many employees trying to wash their brushes out at the same time, appoint a brush cleaner for the day. While the other equip is being put away for the day, one guy cleans the brushes. It's a rotating job. I only had 3 - 5 workers and that worked well. One brush should take no longer than five minutes. I wash out brush, sleeve, tray and cut pot in 5 - 7 minutes. (waterborne)
That's interesting how this profession works. I know a guy who does auto body repair and painting, and he owns several thousand dollars worth of his own tools that he keeps in a gang box. When he is hired to work for a company, he brings his gang box and drops it off at the shop, and it stays there. And, he uses all his own tools.
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Old 07-01-2013, 10:13 AM   #89
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That's interesting tell this profession works. I know a guy who does auto body repair and painting, and he owns several thousand dollars worth of his own tools that he keeps in a gang box. When he is hired to work for a company, he brings his gang box and drops it off at the shop, and it stays there. And, he uses all his own tools.
I know a guy who thinks behr is better than aura. There's all kinds.
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Old 07-01-2013, 10:22 AM   #90
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I know a guy who thinks behr is better than aura. There's all kinds.
And who might that be?
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Old 07-01-2013, 10:23 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by MuraCoat View Post
That's interesting how this profession works. I know a guy who does auto body repair and painting, and he owns several thousand dollars worth of his own tools that he keeps in a gang box. When he is hired to work for a company, he brings his gang box and drops it off at the shop, and it stays there. And, he uses all his own tools.
Yes, it is interesting how different professions work.

Auto mechanics DO supply their own hand tools - although not the expensive lifts, compressors, balancing machines, grinders, millers, etc etc.

In an architectural office where I summered once, the hand tools were supplied by the company.

Landscaping companies supply the rakes, shovels, blowers, etc.

Carpenters (usually) supply their own tools. When I summered for one of them, I bought my own hammer, cat's paw, and a few other basic tools. Company owned the power stuff.

We could go on ad nausem making a list of different professions that approach it differently.



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Old 07-01-2013, 11:55 AM   #92
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I still say if you don't get your employees imvolved in your company, it wont matter who buys what.

Give your employees a sense that they are invested in your company, and they will value your tools & their own.

Start a safety comitee where the employees are encouraged to be proactive about issues (let them help choose topics for your monthly safety meetings, act on suggestions, etc..). Create a safety bonus system where they get a bonus 2 times/ year for being incident free.

Reward them for sharing ideas on better production/ cutting costs.

If there is a disconnect between your company and its employees, they aint gonna buy quality tools and they definitely won't take care of your tools.

Thats how a fortune 500 comp i worked for did things. And they were voted forbes best place to work a few years.
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Old 07-01-2013, 12:25 PM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daArch View Post

Yes, it is interesting how different professions work.

Auto mechanics DO supply their own hand tools - although not the expensive lifts, compressors, balancing machines, grinders, millers, etc etc.

In an architectural office where I summered once, the hand tools were supplied by the company.

Landscaping companies supply the rakes, shovels, blowers, etc.

Carpenters (usually) supply their own tools. When I summered for one of them, I bought my own hammer, cat's paw, and a few other basic tools. Company owned the power stuff.

We could go on ad nausem making a list of different professions that approach it differently.
Well arch, we are all independent contractors, and there is no right and wrong way to handle this type of situation. As an independent contractor, we have the power to make our own set of rules that employees have to adhere to. Just from experience, I find that employees could give a damn about my equipment. That includes the cleanliness of my vehicles. Nothing worse than a painter getting paint all over the exterior doors, seats, capping paint cans halfway and they end up spillover in the truck etc. Employees equals problems and headaches.
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Old 07-01-2013, 09:41 PM   #94
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Originally Posted by MuraCoat View Post
Have you ever estimated, how much money you lose per year doing all of the above?
We track all of our costs. Tools and equipment are no different. We spend less than .01% of our total costs to run a business on the tools necessary to outfit each truck.

And as a matter of fact every employee is entitled to join the our health insurance plan after 6 months of employment. We pay 50% of their individual coverage for the first two years of employment. Full individual after 2 years and full family coverage after 5 years.

In turn we have a very good rate of retention and have dedicated employees.
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Old 07-01-2013, 09:50 PM   #95
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Well arch, we are all independent contractors, and there is no right and wrong way to handle this type of situation. As an independent contractor, we have the power to make our own set of rules that employees have to adhere to. Just from experience, I find that employees could give a damn about my equipment. That includes the cleanliness of my vehicles. Nothing worse than a painter getting paint all over the exterior doors, seats, capping paint cans halfway and they end up spillover in the truck etc. Employees equals problems and headaches.
You are absolutely correct about independent, no right or wrong, and the all too common lack of respect for the company/bosses junk.

I think this post by driftweed addresses the issue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by driftweed View Post
I still say if you don't get your employees imvolved in your company, it wont matter who buys what.

Give your employees a sense that they are invested in your company, and they will value your tools & their own.

Start a safety comitee where the employees are encouraged to be proactive about issues (let them help choose topics for your monthly safety meetings, act on suggestions, etc..). Create a safety bonus system where they get a bonus 2 times/ year for being incident free.

Reward them for sharing ideas on better production/ cutting costs.

If there is a disconnect between your company and its employees, they aint gonna buy quality tools and they definitely won't take care of your tools.

Thats how a fortune 500 comp i worked for did things. And they were voted forbes best place to work a few years.


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Old 07-01-2013, 10:51 PM   #96
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Brushes are the least of your expenses.
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Old 07-06-2013, 07:02 AM   #97
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I love my tools. Occasionally i ask my employer for a new linbide scraper blade, and a monarch brush pack. But I look after all tools. It's probably the first lesson l learned.
I do buy my own syntox brushes for clears and choose to use my own 460m microfibres rollers. Just save me time and are a pleasure to use.
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Old 07-06-2013, 09:11 AM   #98
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Well arch, we are all independent contractors, and there is no right and wrong way to handle this type of situation. As an independent contractor, we have the power to make our own set of rules that employees have to adhere to. Just from experience, I find that employees could give a damn about my equipment. That includes the cleanliness of my vehicles. Nothing worse than a painter getting paint all over the exterior doors, seats, capping paint cans halfway and they end up spillover in the truck etc. Employees equals problems and headaches.
Maybe it's the paint you make them use... I keed... either way, you sound like a real dream to work for.
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