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Old 07-22-2019, 04:22 PM   #1
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Default Window Grids help

Is there a magical way to paint the window grids or is it a time hog for everyone? I think I lost a job because they had 10 old windows and 2 doors with window grids. I tacked on an extra $100 each, on top of the normal cost for a window or door. Because of the doors and windows being single pane there is damage to finish from condensation. They have to be sanded, washed, primed, 2 coats of paint. Then the windows need to be scraped and cleaned. Each window is at least an extra 2 hours per side. Is there a magic trick I should learn?

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Old 07-22-2019, 05:00 PM   #2
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@cardgunner Sorry to tell you, there is no magic for such jobs. I just finished a set of carriage house doors with at least 300, 2" muntin bars (What you are calling a grid) They required a lot of glazing compound in places where the putty had gone bad, stripping of the old paint, oil primer on those bars (AFTER THE GLAZING HAD SET / AT LEAST 10 days) and then 2 coats of paint. I charged the job as time & material. It cost a small fortune but the guy wanted the job done right. My currant job is window restoration on 10 windows all 9 lights over 1 or 12 muntin bars each, both inside & out, again I'm going T&M. I should have turned down the first job because once people see what your doing or did, a lot more of similar type work comes calling. I'll turn down a third job (this year) with such windows! I'm tired of picking nits!
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Old 07-22-2019, 05:32 PM   #3
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Even the the true grids on modern windows are a time consuming PIA if they are different finish on either side (which 99% of the time they are). Only one side can be sprayed. The other must be done by hand. Maybe there is a way to spray both sides, but I never figured it out.

Traditional windows with muntins in poor shape can get quite expensive to do right. I would say at adding a $100 a window, the HO is getting a borderline bargain.
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Old 07-22-2019, 06:59 PM   #4
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I hate them too. So frustrating when one side is stained and the other side is painted white. No matter which side you do first, you end up wiping excess that trickles around to the other side and just when you think you've got it all, you see a bunch you forgot to wipe.
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Old 07-22-2019, 08:04 PM   #5
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I hate them too. So frustrating when one side is stained and the other side is painted white. No matter which side you do first, you end up wiping excess that trickles around to the other side and just when you think you've got it all, you see a bunch you forgot to wipe.
I always totally finished the stain side first... all spray work. Then the PIA paint side. As you said - more wiping than painting. I found it helped a lot to do only one section, then wipe. Less likely to miss areas and paint overlap doesn't have time to dry on stain side.

People would usually dang near go apoplectic when hearing the price for doing the grids...until they would see what is involved.

I found a 1" Shurline velour applicator as being superior in painting window grids. In fact, it's the only thing I ever found those applicators to be useful for. And they work very well on window grids.

A big new house can have upwards of 100 said grids (usually 2 per window) or more. So it would be a day or so for one guy to spray all 3 coats on the stain side, and a week or more on the paint side. The patience of Job my friend, the patience of Job.
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Old 07-23-2019, 12:15 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cardgunner View Post
Is there a magical way to paint the window grids or is it a time hog for everyone? I think I lost a job because they had 10 old windows and 2 doors with window grids. I tacked on an extra $100 each, on top of the normal cost for a window or door. Because of the doors and windows being single pane there is damage to finish from condensation. They have to be sanded, washed, primed, 2 coats of paint. Then the windows need to be scraped and cleaned. Each window is at least an extra 2 hours per side. Is there a magic trick I should learn?
I've used 'liquid mask' for exterior windows that had muntins on the storm windows. Worked out well. I sprayed it on and peeled it off the glass after it was painted.

I currently am working on lacquering some interior windows with muntins but don't trust that it is compatible with lacquer.

https://www.amazon.com/Jasco-GJMS002.../dp/B0067NLX5A
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Old 07-23-2019, 05:26 PM   #7
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Quote:
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Traditional windows with muntins in poor shape can get quite expensive to do right. I would say at adding a $100 a window, the HO is getting a borderline bargain.
Sadly, that is what he is dealing with and again, there is no quick and easy on old wood muntins.
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Old 08-05-2019, 10:33 AM   #8
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Very well written. Keep it up.
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Old 08-12-2019, 12:28 PM   #9
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Yes, nothing to really do for it, you can easily be underbid by someone who's just going to spray and leave it poorly done.
Tell the homeowner this "You can get lower prices by someone satisfied by doing a poor, drippy job, if that's what you want best of luck to you, but I have my standards and am not interested in doing anything but good"
Leave them your card anyway
May lose a few jobs but they'll regret it, better than losing business you didn't even know you could get because they see a crappy job IMO
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Old 08-12-2019, 11:12 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Smith View Post
I've used 'liquid mask' for exterior windows that had muntins on the storm windows. Worked out well. I sprayed it on and peeled it off the glass after it was painted.

https://www.amazon.com/Jasco-GJMS002.../dp/B0067NLX5A
*It's all the sanding on all those bars that makes me crazy! I have never found a way to do that other than hand sanding, any machine risks scratching the glass.. Strip & Sand, Prime and sand, Finish coat and Sand. It takes forever!
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Old 08-25-2019, 04:39 AM   #11
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We once did a job for a family that replaced their old windows and were shocked to see the bids to paint the new windows, They were roll-outs with grids, the worst kind, and two coats of primer a a coat of paint or 1 and 2 coats were required.

Mr, Smith mentioned using liquid mask, not sure if that is better then just masking in the end. when roll and brushing a tape line is fine. As far as sanding sanding sponges should be good depending on what is on there and how it is peeling.

I would avoid those jobs unless you have the experience, it is not fair for the homeowner to pay you to earn as you learn or the painter to loose to have a learning experience.

Examine the existing paint, is it falling off all over or can a light sanding and spot or full prime get it ready for the finish coat.

Jenifer, I time myself a lot and when I have repetitive tasks like sanding doors and I use sanders a lot, with random orbital sanders I will trim off the edges and will tape the paper edges of palm sanders to protect glass or opposite wood surfaces.

In the end you have to consider are you a painter or a wood re-finisher or wood restorer?

In the home I rent each window was lead paint and not painted in likely 40 years or never since new. Each window set was like 3 hours to clean, sand, caulk, prime, sand finish coat and perhaps second coat.
Time masking or time scraping paint beyond the lines.
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