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Old 01-18-2010, 01:26 PM   #1
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Default Wanna work together to improve margins?

Am always looking to improve business. Just ordered a book recommended on another forum. If any body wants to order a copy and set up some kind of discussion forum let me know. We can work out the details later.


http://www.amazon.com/Markup-Profit-Contractors-Michael-Stone/dp/1572180714/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1263838729&sr=8-1

(I'm Reading it anyway)
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Old 01-18-2010, 02:43 PM   #2
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I will see what I can do, sounds like a good idea though man
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Old 01-18-2010, 02:53 PM   #3
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I'm in.
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Old 01-18-2010, 06:46 PM   #4
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I'm in. Been wanting to get that book for sometime now. Gonna order it now. Thanks for the motivation!
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Old 01-18-2010, 08:02 PM   #5
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Do y'all want to set up a weekly conference call or webex meeting? And just shoot the sh!t about what is working and is not working for us. Basically, a brainstorming session mixed with some facts and opinions. Weekly may be too frequent - IDK. After a meeting or two we could develop an agenda to make it more productive. Just some random thoughts.
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Old 01-18-2010, 08:43 PM   #6
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Fresh has a good idea, maybe just monthly though. I want to read the book but I've 2 I've got to finish before I get anything else.
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Old 01-20-2010, 01:04 PM   #7
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Got a copy in the mail already. Gonna start reading soon.
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Old 01-20-2010, 02:49 PM   #8
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Be careful, estimating from a book... They don't run companies, they write about them.


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Old 01-20-2010, 06:28 PM   #9
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It's less about estimating and more about how to arrive at proper margins for your business.

As far as estimating from a book, if you don't know how, ya gotta learn somewhere.

Fresh, I like the conference call idea. Picking brains live without having to deal with people not reading the book would be the most productive.

Right now it is only three. Most phone companies allow that through your regular plan.
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Old 01-20-2010, 08:08 PM   #10
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Be careful, estimating from a book... They don't run companies, they write about them.


Stay Frosty
Who said it was estimating in a book?
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Old 01-21-2010, 04:16 PM   #11
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Got mine today. Not one chapter on estimating. Guess that is why the title is "Markup and Profit a contractors guide."
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Old 01-21-2010, 05:26 PM   #12
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Default Margins -converting the consumer

I guess there are many confronting under-pricing who share the view that the issue is as much to do with educating the public as cajoling lowballers about margins.

In a profession deemed easy to enter, there will always be practitioners who bid low out of ignorance. There are many threads on this forum that seek a remedy to this problem by appealing to the concept of professional standards. However, those standards are invariably policed only by the HO, often in hindsight and sometimes at inconvenient cost.

The problem is accentuated by promotions that encourage the HO to tackle jobs effortlessly themselves or to hire cheap tradesmen for “that remodelling job you’ve been promising yourself”. That kind of work may involve considerable preparation, or a certain quality of paint, or a specific application that is crucial. The devil may indeed be in the detail but marketing serves to simplify the attraction, enticing the consumer to embrace the art rather than the science.

A HO confronts the doctrine of caveat emptor whenever they employ tradesmen. This onerous responsibility ought to compel them to ensure that tradesmen are suitably qualified. But the HO is often buying blind and must rely heavily on reputation by word of mouth for guidance. One of the beauties of service industries is their dispersed level of choice, but that has its drawbacks when a common theme is required. Maybe the way the profession markets itself lies at the heart of this conundrum.

In essence, every proprietor is trying to broadcast his/her professional skill. As an individual that’s fine but what about the profession as a whole? Painter skills require knowledge of the composition, application and suitability of paint and ancillary materials. The market may be too fragmented for it to define and broadcast a coherent message about this skill set. But there is certainly a message to get across; ask the paint manufacturers!

In a discussion of this topic, it is impossible to ignore the fall-out from economic upheavals. Just as a rising tide raises all boats, a falling one leaves many beached. Over the decade to 2008 there had been a rising tide of affluence that promoted the concept of cash rich and time poor consumers splashing out on household indulgences and moving residence at frequently intervals.

Now that the economy is hunkering down, this pattern is reversed. Almost 9% of mortgages in the US were more than 90 days late or in the foreclosure process during the third quarter (Mortgage Bankers Association figures). Furthermore, employment in the important 25-44 age group is down 8% since the recession began (CreditSights figures).

In these straightened times it may be worth suggesting to your next prospective client that if they get an ultra low quote, make sure the painter knows stipple from spittle.
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Old 01-21-2010, 09:10 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patti View Post
I guess there are many confronting under-pricing who share the view that the issue is as much to do with educating the public as cajoling lowballers about margins.

In a profession deemed easy to enter, there will always be practitioners who bid low out of ignorance. There are many threads on this forum that seek a remedy to this problem by appealing to the concept of professional standards. However, those standards are invariably policed only by the HO, often in hindsight and sometimes at inconvenient cost.

The problem is accentuated by promotions that encourage the HO to tackle jobs effortlessly themselves or to hire cheap tradesmen for “that remodelling job you’ve been promising yourself”. That kind of work may involve considerable preparation, or a certain quality of paint, or a specific application that is crucial. The devil may indeed be in the detail but marketing serves to simplify the attraction, enticing the consumer to embrace the art rather than the science.

A HO confronts the doctrine of caveat emptor whenever they employ tradesmen. This onerous responsibility ought to compel them to ensure that tradesmen are suitably qualified. But the HO is often buying blind and must rely heavily on reputation by word of mouth for guidance. One of the beauties of service industries is their dispersed level of choice, but that has its drawbacks when a common theme is required. Maybe the way the profession markets itself lies at the heart of this conundrum.

In essence, every proprietor is trying to broadcast his/her professional skill. As an individual that’s fine but what about the profession as a whole? Painter skills require knowledge of the composition, application and suitability of paint and ancillary materials. The market may be too fragmented for it to define and broadcast a coherent message about this skill set. But there is certainly a message to get across; ask the paint manufacturers!

In a discussion of this topic, it is impossible to ignore the fall-out from economic upheavals. Just as a rising tide raises all boats, a falling one leaves many beached. Over the decade to 2008 there had been a rising tide of affluence that promoted the concept of cash rich and time poor consumers splashing out on household indulgences and moving residence at frequently intervals.

Now that the economy is hunkering down, this pattern is reversed. Almost 9% of mortgages in the US were more than 90 days late or in the foreclosure process during the third quarter (Mortgage Bankers Association figures). Furthermore, employment in the important 25-44 age group is down 8% since the recession began (CreditSights figures).

In these straightened times it may be worth suggesting to your next prospective client that if they get an ultra low quote, make sure the painter knows stipple from spittle.
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Old 01-22-2010, 08:57 AM   #14
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Who said it was estimating in a book?
I appologize,.... Good luck with the Book !!
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Old 01-22-2010, 08:59 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patti View Post
I guess there are many confronting under-pricing who share the view that the issue is as much to do with educating the public as cajoling lowballers about margins.

In a profession deemed easy to enter, there will always be practitioners who bid low out of ignorance. There are many threads on this forum that seek a remedy to this problem by appealing to the concept of professional standards. However, those standards are invariably policed only by the HO, often in hindsight and sometimes at inconvenient cost.

The problem is accentuated by promotions that encourage the HO to tackle jobs effortlessly themselves or to hire cheap tradesmen for “that remodelling job you’ve been promising yourself”. That kind of work may involve considerable preparation, or a certain quality of paint, or a specific application that is crucial. The devil may indeed be in the detail but marketing serves to simplify the attraction, enticing the consumer to embrace the art rather than the science.

A HO confronts the doctrine of caveat emptor whenever they employ tradesmen. This onerous responsibility ought to compel them to ensure that tradesmen are suitably qualified. But the HO is often buying blind and must rely heavily on reputation by word of mouth for guidance. One of the beauties of service industries is their dispersed level of choice, but that has its drawbacks when a common theme is required. Maybe the way the profession markets itself lies at the heart of this conundrum.

In essence, every proprietor is trying to broadcast his/her professional skill. As an individual that’s fine but what about the profession as a whole? Painter skills require knowledge of the composition, application and suitability of paint and ancillary materials. The market may be too fragmented for it to define and broadcast a coherent message about this skill set. But there is certainly a message to get across; ask the paint manufacturers!

In a discussion of this topic, it is impossible to ignore the fall-out from economic upheavals. Just as a rising tide raises all boats, a falling one leaves many beached. Over the decade to 2008 there had been a rising tide of affluence that promoted the concept of cash rich and time poor consumers splashing out on household indulgences and moving residence at frequently intervals.

Now that the economy is hunkering down, this pattern is reversed. Almost 9% of mortgages in the US were more than 90 days late or in the foreclosure process during the third quarter (Mortgage Bankers Association figures). Furthermore, employment in the important 25-44 age group is down 8% since the recession began (CreditSights figures).

In these straightened times it may be worth suggesting to your next prospective client that if they get an ultra low quote, make sure the painter knows stipple from spittle.
You are in the wrong buisness, or take to many pills ?
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Old 01-22-2010, 10:19 AM   #16
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I appologize,.... Good luck with the Book !!
ahhh.....you were looking out for us. That's always a good thing.
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