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Old 11-06-2012, 03:56 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by DeanV

I am working with agualente around 350psi fluid and 20-25 psi air. First time agualente has microbubbled on me using the same setups. I must be missing something.
I think you are cursed Dean. First the Picasso's and now the clears.
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Old 11-06-2012, 04:49 PM   #22
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I am either the unluckiest painter here or the only one that does not lie. Not sure which...and it has gotten worse lately it seems.

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Old 11-06-2012, 06:08 PM   #23
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Dean have you been in contact with an MLC rep to see what he had to say? I won't use any more of this product or any like it if I can't figure it out. Nothing worse than doing all the prep work and then the last thing you do cause more work. Even worse its supposed to be the easiest part.

I am at the point that I think using solvents and wearing a full suit is the only way I want to go. I need to invest in better ventilation but I will gladly due it not to have to sand down and recoat.
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Old 11-06-2012, 06:37 PM   #24
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I am a parttime handyman, so the cure time does not impact me as much - I only paint on the weekends. I am concerned about the comments on the BM advance not being hard & can scratch with a finger nail.

Is anyone else seeing this?
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Old 11-06-2012, 06:37 PM   #25
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Dean have you been in contact with an MLC rep to see what he had to say? I won't use any more of this product or any like it if I can't figure it out. Nothing worse than doing all the prep work and then the last thing you do cause more work. Even worse its supposed to be the easiest part.

I am at the point that I think using solvents and wearing a full suit is the only way I want to go. I need to invest in better ventilation but I will gladly due it not to have to sand down and recoat.
Can you guys post some pics of all this problems you guys are having with clears.

I've only use lacquers, polyurethanes and shellac but none of the WB's.
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Old 11-06-2012, 06:49 PM   #26
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I am a parttime handyman, so the cure time does not impact me as much - I only paint on the weekends. I am concerned about the comments on the BM advance not being hard & can scratch with a finger nail.

Is anyone else seeing this?
Not after is fully cured, I painted some kitchen cabinets a little more than a year, they get a lot abuse from kids, I went by that home 3 weeks ago and they still look like new.

I just finish painting a bedroom with lots of trim with Advance, after 3 days i could not scratch it with my finger nail. Very good product.
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Old 11-06-2012, 06:58 PM   #27
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My BM doesn't carry Cabinet coat, so we will go with BM Melamine paint. It's a polurhethane paint that is discontinued but my store still have some gallon left.
Anybody used it before? Do you think we should prime first. I'm not sure if there's an advantage to prime with a WB like stix before an allyd finish???
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Old 11-06-2012, 07:01 PM   #28
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My BM doesn't carry Cabinet coat, so we will go with BM Melamine paint. It's a polurhethane paint that is discontinued but my store still have some gallon left.
Anybody used it before? Do you think we should prime first. I'm not sure if there's an advantage to prime with a WB like stix before an allyd finish???
I would prime with Stix, I've never heard of that product (melamine) so I can not comment on that.
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Old 11-06-2012, 07:04 PM   #29
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Quote:
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My BM doesn't carry Cabinet coat, so we will go with BM Melamine paint. It's a polurhethane paint that is discontinued but my store still have some gallon left.
Anybody used it before? Do you think we should prime first. I'm not sure if there's an advantage to prime with a WB like stix before an allyd finish???
BTW I've seen alkyds and oils fail when just applied over something that was lacquered before even if it was scuffed and de-glossed.
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Old 11-06-2012, 07:09 PM   #30
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I like Zinners B-I-N (white pigmented shellac), top coated with Satin Imprevo.
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Old 11-06-2012, 07:17 PM   #31
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I like Zinners B-I-N (white pigmented shellac), top coated with Satin Imprevo.
It's a great combination, but I'm personally trying to use Low VOC, Low Odor products and mainly WB's.
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Old 11-06-2012, 07:19 PM   #32
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Can you guys post some pics of all this problems you guys are having with clears.

I've only use lacquers, polyurethanes and shellac but none of the WB's.
Edgar these aren't clears we are referring to right now. I have some of what both wet, and cured microfoam look like. These expanded as the finish cured, millage was to spec, and prep was all the same. Had this happen on about six or seven doors.



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Old 11-06-2012, 07:37 PM   #33
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Edgar these aren't clears we are referring to right now. I have some of what both wet, and cured microfoam look like. These expanded as the finish cured, millage was to spec, and prep was all the same. Had this happen on about six or seven doors.
Sorry I meant to say Pigmented WB's. I got confused with clears.
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Old 11-06-2012, 07:41 PM   #34
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Does that happen with clears too? I was just today asking at the paint store about Agualente.
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Old 11-06-2012, 07:43 PM   #35
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usually, right after spraying everything looks good. But, soon after the coating is laid down the microbubbles start forming.

I really thought this was not going to be an issue with ML Campbell since our first run with it was very promising. Now, I just do not know anymore. I keep thinking I must be doing something wrong and keep trying to change pressure, tips, product, etc to little avail it seems. I do need to track down sec-butyl and try that (Wolfgang mentioned that in an old post). My shop is not to code for solvent based stuff and I really do not want to drop 30k to upgrade. There would be no payback on that investment.

The downside is that when this stuff works well, it is my favorite kind of project to do. When it goes wrong, I usually do not find reps are much help. It is always the same song and dance..."No one else...., Never heard of it...., first time...." And then later you hear it is a known issue, other people have problems as well, etc.
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Old 11-06-2012, 07:47 PM   #36
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I have more experience with the clear Agualente and that product is doing it as well over the black polystar ML Campbell black wb lacquer. And over itself.

It tends not to be a problem with HVLP but more with AAA (and I would assume airless, just guessing). But, I prefer the way AAA applies to HVLP. AAA, for me, is the best of airless and the best of HVLP. Talking more of the Kremlin, CA Tech, Merkur style AAA than the Graco FinishPro 395. Not knocking the FinishPro, but it is not the same things as the others. More airless like than an even split IMHO. And my IMHO is usually wrong.
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Old 11-06-2012, 08:28 PM   #37
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I have a feeling you may be right about these types of finishes. 395 does really well pushing heavy acrylics.

You have a CA tech pump thou right?
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Old 11-06-2012, 08:38 PM   #38
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Yep. Once I got it up and running, I really liked it. Now, I am not certain. I think it is more a finish issue than a machine issue though. Or applicator. Or conditions. Or position of the Moon. Or it is Steve Richards fault.
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Old 11-06-2012, 10:02 PM   #39
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I've had this similar bubbling effect using cabinet coat but only in select areas. I figured it was because I was applying the product too heavily with lapped passes on some kitchen chairs. I swapped tips rather than adjusting my movement and the issue was resolved. Maybe we're talking about different things, but I'm offering this as an option because these photos look like the same issue I was having.

Anybody shooting in cooler temperatures?
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:23 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeanV View Post
usually, right after spraying everything looks good. But, soon after the coating is laid down the microbubbles start forming.

I really thought this was not going to be an issue with ML Campbell since our first run with it was very promising. Now, I just do not know anymore. I keep thinking I must be doing something wrong and keep trying to change pressure, tips, product, etc to little avail it seems. I do need to track down sec-butyl and try that (Wolfgang mentioned that in an old post). My shop is not to code for solvent based stuff and I really do not want to drop 30k to upgrade. There would be no payback on that investment.

The downside is that when this stuff works well, it is my favorite kind of project to do. When it goes wrong, I usually do not find reps are much help. It is always the same song and dance..."No one else...., Never heard of it...., first time...." And then later you hear it is a known issue, other people have problems as well, etc.
You might want to read Greg Saunders stuff about wb lacquers. he likes to use retarders,specifically 50/50 mix of glycol & water mixed together and gently added to wb lacquer while stirring. he says up to 7% for pigmented lacquers or 4% for clears.

http://woodfinishings.wordpress.com/...-and-coatings/

he also like to heat wb lacquers.

that kremlin inline heater runs about $1500

http://woodfinishings.wordpress.com/...acquer-heater/

http://woodfinishings.wordpress.com/...ased-lacquers/

Last edited by Xmark; 11-07-2012 at 12:29 AM..
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