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Old 09-05-2018, 11:05 PM   #1
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Default Everyone is underordering......

I've had five jobs come to me this week, where they all ordered the product, THEN, called me to install it. After I do the math, I tell them they will be short on material....

One of which was for a 9'x7' ceiling, and they only ordered 8 yards.... (they needed 13-14, and this was high end stuff.) So, they scrapped the job. A week later, someone wants the back of two built in cabinets done. 10' x6' total. They just happened to have 8 yards of the exact same material... Apparently, this was the decorina who underordered the material for the other client. She probably had to eat the cost, and was trying to use it in her own house...

I just got another call from someone who followed Anthropologie's badass wallpaper calculator for a product with a 44" straight match repeat. Their calculator is this: Multiply ceiling height by wall length. This is your square feet. Each roll is 56 square feet. Round up.

Then, the clients get mad at me, when I tell them they ordered half as much as they needed....
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Old 09-06-2018, 10:05 PM   #2
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I know this may ruffle the feathers of those who do wall covering but why not buy the product yourself and make sure the quantity is correct? I mean we do it for paint and bitch about when a h.o. buys it. As a pro you know how to correctly measure and order so dye lots are all the same and have plenty of lead time in case of a special order product. And I do call it paste.
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Old 09-06-2018, 11:10 PM   #3
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I know this may ruffle the feathers of those who do wall covering but why not buy the product yourself and make sure the quantity is correct? I mean we do it for paint and bitch about when a h.o. buys it. As a pro you know how to correctly measure and order so dye lots are all the same and have plenty of lead time in case of a special order product. And I do call it paste.
If you read my post correctly, you'd understand that Im talking about people who are calling me to hang product they ALREADY ordered before consulting me, or an experienced designer, or looked up a friggin' wallpaper calculator which is readily available online.

Wallpaper isnt like paint. If someone calls you and says they need a bedroom painted, and they bought two quarts, you can simply go get more. Wallpaper can take WEEKS to get more if there wasnt enough ordered. Not only that, but if it wasnt printed from the same batch, the colors can be WAY off. They arent concerned with perfect color matching when they print new batches of paper. So, if you need more, and they cant get any from the same batch, they have to either send back, or throw away $1000 worth of paper and order a whole new batch.

When anyone calls me, I do the calculations, and I tell them how much they need to order. I keep getting calls from people, I do the calculations, and tell them they need four double rolls, and they go "Well, my wall is 100 square feet, so I ordered two rolls, cuz its 57 feet per roll, so why wont that work?" Then I have to try to explain complex math to a simpleton, and they get pissed, and scrap the job, or if Im lucky, itll pop back up in two months.

Also, installers DO NOT buy the material. The client, designer, or contractor does the buying. Would you buy $10,000 of material you are only gonna make $2000 installing?? HELL NO. Not to mention, some of these wallpaper companies wont sell to anyone except designers.
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Old 09-07-2018, 01:21 AM   #4
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Wood, you are somewhat contradicting your own words. Installers (contractors) buy the majority of wallcoverings, I've never heard of a contractor not being able to buy WC!

If your letting your inferior decorators, order material without you measuring, your going to be in for a world of hurt.
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Old 09-07-2018, 06:31 AM   #5
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Wood, you are somewhat contradicting your own words. Installers (contractors) buy the majority of wallcoverings, I've never heard of a contractor not being able to buy WC!

If your letting your inferior decorators, order material without you measuring, your going to be in for a world of hurt.
It's true!
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Old 09-07-2018, 09:01 PM   #6
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I've been installing for over 30 years and have never supplied material.
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Old 09-08-2018, 01:28 AM   #7
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I've been installing for over 30 years and have never supplied material.
Then you're in for a world of hurt!
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Old 09-08-2018, 06:54 AM   #8
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I am with Gwarel, not ever been hurt and never will be, I don't understand your point
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Old 09-08-2018, 08:49 AM   #9
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@Brushman4 / @chrisn

I'm with woodco, I would never layout that much for a job that was not going to pay as much in return.

It depends on the wall covering. There are some really high end specialty papers out there; they cost the earth! Some do prefer to deal with designers and architects. ("Most Adelphi customers work directly with designers to select and acquire our products. Qualified designers may contact the showrooms listed below, under To the Trade.")

Many wall papers are created and printed on demand. If that is the case, good luck on ever getting a true match on reorder! Even stock printed can easily run 3-4000 for an average bedroom. If it is from the last runs of William Morris Wall papers the clients are really out of luck. They are closed and only supplying the remaining paid orders, the same goes for Charles Rupert Designs.

http://www.adelphipaperhangings.com/ordering.html
http://hamiltonweston.com/
https://bradbury.com/dfw_830-noir.html

If he gets calls from someone that has already ordered and just wants it applied he only has 2 options, yes or no.

Some of you might remember I walked off a papering job for an historic village earlier this summer. I was pretty sure they did not have enough paper and the walls were far from ready. I got spooked and ran.
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Old 09-08-2018, 11:49 AM   #10
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Then you're in for a world of hurt!
Wallpaper is notorious for being defective, and manufacturers are notorious for not standing behind their ridiculously expensive materials. The world of hurt is in the liability. Count me out......
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Old 09-08-2018, 12:56 PM   #11
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I am with Gwarel, not ever been hurt and never will be, I don't understand your point
The point being that many inferior decorators don't know up from down, that's why if you rely on them to order WC you most likely are going to be short or have a ton leftover!

Do you also have your decorinas order your paint for you?
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Old 09-08-2018, 04:59 PM   #12
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I tell the decorina's,/homeowners exactly what to order. My problem is that people keep ordering the material before even contacting me. I've never heard of an installer purchasing the material. I would never do that. I'll supply the paste, and liner paper. The paper needs to be onsite when I show up. Its totally different than ordering paint.

Do plumbers buy the sinks and faucets? Do electricians buy the ceiling fans and chandeliers?

Either the homeowner, the designer, or the GC buys that kind of stuff. By "contractor," I was referring to a GC. Its rare that a GC has any hand in wallpaper, but it happens. Basically, whoever picks it out, purchases it.
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Old 09-08-2018, 11:08 PM   #13
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The point being that many inferior decorators don't know up from down, that's why if you rely on them to order WC you most likely are going to be short or have a ton leftover!
Well I won't disagree that things can easily go sideways, even after you field measure. Double rolls, single rolls, Euro rolls, many ways for the middle man to screw up the deal. I've even had the customer tell me, after I got to the job and they were short from what I measured, that " The guy at SW said I didn't need that much."
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Old 09-09-2018, 12:32 AM   #14
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Look, I've worked for most of the largest shops in Chicago. These PC did the largest office and hotel jobs, I'm talking sometimes 30,000 yards plus of 54" vinyl etc.

I know for a fact that most of them ordered and supplied the WC, at a hefty markup the hotels or GC's could not match!

I also know for a fact that they had suppliers/manufacturers that made knock-offs so close to the product that no one could tell and made even more money off of that.
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Old 09-09-2018, 02:27 AM   #15
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@Brushman4 / @chrisn

I'm with woodco, I would never layout that much for a job that was not going to pay as much in return.

It depends on the wall covering. There are some really high end specialty papers out there; they cost the earth! Some do prefer to deal with designers and architects. ("Most Adelphi customers work directly with designers to select and acquire our products. Qualified designers may contact the showrooms listed below, under To the Trade.")

Many wall papers are created and printed on demand. If that is the case, good luck on ever getting a true match on reorder! Even stock printed can easily run 3-4000 for an average bedroom. If it is from the last runs of William Morris Wall papers the clients are really out of luck. They are closed and only supplying the remaining paid orders, the same goes for Charles Rupert Designs.

http://www.adelphipaperhangings.com/ordering.html
http://hamiltonweston.com/
https://bradbury.com/dfw_830-noir.html

If he gets calls from someone that has already ordered and just wants it applied he only has 2 options, yes or no.

Some of you might remember I walked off a papering job for an historic village earlier this summer. I was pretty sure they did not have enough paper and the walls were far from ready. I got spooked and ran.
This is who most if not all of the largest painting and wallcovering contractors in Chicago ordered their goods from....http://www.mdcwall.com/home/company/our-story
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Old 09-09-2018, 09:15 AM   #16
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This is who most if not all of the largest painting and wallcovering contractors in Chicago ordered their goods from....http://www.mdcwall.com/home/company/our-story

So, what's your point here? I was only showing the problems with "exclusive" papers, the costs and the risks. (Thanks to Decorators, no doubt) It sounds, by the stated cost, woodco's people had ordered just such expensive nonsense.
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Old 09-09-2018, 11:30 AM   #17
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So, what's your point here? I was only showing the problems with "exclusive" papers, the costs and the risks. (Thanks to Decorators, no doubt) It sounds, by the stated cost, woodco's people had ordered just such expensive nonsense.
My point here is that not everyone has their inferior decorators order the wrong amounts of WC. Some forward-thinking contractors order it themselves and mark it up handsomely and maximize their profit!

That's the only point I was trying to make, OK?
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Old 09-09-2018, 09:56 PM   #18
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Been hanging for close to 30 years now, I never purchase product. Designers and/or homeowners supply wallcoverings, not me. The ONLY wallcovering contractors I know that purchase/supply material are vinyl jockeys who do commercial projects. I don't do work in that category myself.
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Old 09-10-2018, 01:55 AM   #19
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Been hanging for close to 30 years now, I never purchase product. Designers and/or homeowners supply wallcoverings, not me. The ONLY wallcovering contractors I know that purchase/supply material are vinyl jockeys who do commercial projects. I don't do work in that category myself.
Vinyl jockeys? Meaning contractors who make money off of not only installation but on the material?
In other words, a contractor who maximizes his profit?

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Old 09-10-2018, 04:40 AM   #20
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Commercial installation is a different animal. You're talking about "large wallpaper companies." They are obviously commercial oriented. Its a different animal, than us one man operations. Most of the stuff we do, is a one wall treatments. A designer isnt likely to turn it over to us anyway, as they make their cut on it too. I charge an arm and a leg for the install. Like I said, they already have the stuff picked out before they even call me. Why would they have me order it an tack on an extra 10% or whatever? It wouldnt make sense for them.
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