[BenPaintinTooLong]

Got a call from Certa Pro today and they are looking for subs to do exteriors for 50 to 55 % of the jobs, you buy all material.
Can't see it myself, but if anyone is interested e mail me and I will give you his #.The jobs are in Westchester co. NY, (Clinton country).

 

[Rich]

Certa Pro is looking for subs all the time. I looked into it a while back, but you need a 2 man crew and workers comp as a minimum...and I'm a 1 man operation. I couldn't get them to budge.

So pretty much call them anywhere, they are looking for subs.

 

[BenPaintinTooLong]

You are right I think they use all subs all the time. The manager told me he had 10 crews going and needed 3 more to keep up with the work.
They must have great leeds and advertisment going on with that much work.
I would never sub for 50 % from any one just not enough money . I too am a one man band but I am going to change all that this year, got a plan.

 

[Petero]

Certa-Pro
Hi again...


The very first post I was directed to on this site brought me to a discussion which included Certa-Pro, but CP itself wasn't the central subject of the discussion.

I'm been contacted by them, apparently the northern Maine franchise closed & the southern franchise is expanding to absorb some of the territory. Anyway, I had initial conversation with them, they took bunch of information, & everything appears favorable & they'll call me next week to schedule an appointment. They asked if I minded a background check, and of course I don't, but I could save them time as I could give them a folder with everything they'll find in a background check.

Anyway, being as pro-active as I am, I'm doing my own background check on them.

So, if anyone knows something, or has had experience with, or knows how the business model is set-up & especially where do I fit-in as a subcontractor in the scheme of all of this.

I'm presuming that, if this works out, I'll be taking the occasional referal from them, but I need to ask. But a little voice in my head says that if I sign on with them, they'll expect full-time performance if they can book the work & mine is expected to take a back seat. Anybody have any knowledge or experience with this?

Thanks in advance.

Peter O,

note: this message has been moved from another thread

 

[kerk]

50-55%? Depends what '50%' is. Percentage doesn't really mean zip without a dollar amount.

If they are charging 3 times what a paint job should cost (like 'well known retailer' painting service used to...1/3 painter-1/3 telemarketing co.-1/3 to the retailer, which rhymes with 'gears'), then I suppose 50% of the customer screw job is good money.

But if their quotes are competitive, why bother? Just price 'your own' bids at 75% of a normally competitive bid, and see how busy you get.

I can work 24/7 for minimum wage.

 

[bikerboy]

I would never give up building my own business. If they get an attitude and drop you, where do you go for work? If they will be flexible and the money is right, well....

 

[BC_Painter]

50-55%? Depends what '50%' is. Percentage doesn't really mean zip without a dollar amount.

If they are charging 3 times what a paint job should cost (like Sears Painting Service...1/3 painter-1/3 telemarketing co.-1/3 to Sears), then I suppose 50% of the customer screw job is good money.

But if their quotes are competitive, why bother? Just price 'your own' bids at 75% of a normally competitive bid, and see how busy you get.

I can work 24/7 for minimum wage.

Generally chargerates vary from 35-45 per hour in the markets I have worked. Plus materials of course. Generally subs get 45-50% of this new amount equating to around 15-20 per hour after paying for materials, assuming the hours are bang on.

In one city I generally hit 80% of their budgets, and was on piecerate as an employee. I made ok money there, but they have since scaled back because of the economy and are not paying as well anymore.

Where I work now I've seen guys make 3 bucks 6 bucks an hour with no more than, sorry, we'll try to make it up to you on the next one....

Some CP estimators don't know how to budget, especially for special conditions and prep above the square foot rates etc. in their little computers, which some are even too stupid to use, instead doing "bulk amounts" that they "know" are right..... Give me a break.

:thumbsup:

 

[KLaw]

Generally chargerates vary from 35-45 per hour in the markets I have worked. Plus materials of course. Generally subs get 45-50% of this new amount equating to around 15-20 per hour after paying for materials, assuming the hours are bang on.

In one city I generally hit 80% of their budgets, and was on piecerate as an employee. I made ok money there, but they have since scaled back because of the economy and are not paying as well anymore.

Where I work now I've seen guys make 3 bucks 6 bucks an hour with no more than, sorry, we'll try to make it up to you on the next one....

Some CP estimators don't know how to budget, especially for special conditions and prep above the square foot rates etc. in their little computers, which some are even too stupid to use, instead doing "bulk amounts" that they "know" are right..... Give me a break.

:thumbsup:

As a sub - do you blindly accept the work and the estimated hrs / matls? Or do you, at least, check out the scope of the work prior to letting a GC wannabe tell you how many hrs you are allowed? If it was someone you trusted then I could understand accepting without seeing but if you don't trust them I would never just say OK - I'll do it for the hrs they stated.

As a sub, I am pretty sure (not positive) that, legally, you should be telling them the price you will do it for. Not the other way around.

 

[BC_Painter]

As a sub - do you blindly accept the work and the estimated hrs / matls? Or do you, at least, check out the scope of the work prior to letting a GC wannabe tell you how many hrs you are allowed? If it was someone you trusted then I could understand accepting without seeing but if you don't trust them I would never just say OK - I'll do it for the hrs they stated.

As a sub, I am pretty sure (not positive) that, legally, you should be telling them the price you will do it for. Not the other way around.

They give me the price, take it or leave it. Usually before I've even seen the job.

On the other hand, they are giving piecerate to employees too that occasionally result in them making below minimum wage

I am sure this is not legal also.

If you do something about it I am sure they will use a different sub anyways so either you take the work or go elsewhere.

 

[KLaw]

Like you said, ultimately - you decide to take it or leave it. So, if you generally get a bum deal then quit accepting. Unless a bum deal is better then no deal.

What do you mean by piece rate? Thanks.

 

[BC_Painter]

Like you said, ultimately - you decide to take it or leave it. So, if you generally get a bum deal then quit accepting. Unless a bum deal is better then no deal.

What do you mean by piece rate? Thanks.

Too many painters with NO work right now, so a bum deal is better than no deal.

Piece rate is basically the same thing as subbing, you get X hours regardless of how long you spend at the house.

They way they work it can be illegal if done incorrectly which I am 99% sure it is. a $26/hr painter getting switched to pieceate and making 6.25 per hour on a job is ridiculous.

The idea is to control costs and give them the opportunity to make more by working more efficiently.

Ultimately it is a flawed system.

 

[KLaw]

Too many painters with NO work right now, so a bum deal is better than no deal.

Piece rate is basically the same thing as subbing, you get X hours regardless of how long you spend at the house.

They way they work it can be illegal if done incorrectly which I am 99% sure it is. a $26/hr painter getting switched to pieceate and making 6.25 per hour on a job is ridiculous.

The idea is to control costs and give them the opportunity to make more by working more efficiently.

Ultimately it is a flawed system.

Cool . I understand where you are coming from. We've got an outfit here that does the same thing. They are huge. If you check their reviews out on yellow pages they are getting slammed by subs that worked for them. You don't hear positive or negative feeedback from the customer though.

I guess they are able to burn bridges because the are so many other painters out there willing to give them a shot. These guys aren't a franchise but I bet the coud be if they wanted.

 

[straight_lines]

Too many painters with NO work right now, so a bum deal is better than no deal.

Piece rate is basically the same thing as subbing, you get X hours regardless of how long you spend at the house.

They way they work it can be illegal if done incorrectly which I am 99% sure it is. a $26/hr painter getting switched to pieceate and making 6.25 per hour on a job is ridiculous.

The idea is to control costs and give them the opportunity to make more by working more efficiently.

Ultimately it is a flawed system.

Yup its a payday something a lot of guys do not have right now. You can make it doing this sub work like this, you won't get rich by a long shot but you can get by on 50%..

 

[BC_Painter]

Yup its a payday something a lot of guys do not have right now. You can make it doing this sub work like this, you won't get rich by a long shot but you can get by on 50%..

That's exactly what I am doing, getting by.

Not comfortable by any means, but my bills are not behind yet, food is on the table and we are not behind on rent.

More than a lot of people can say these days so I'm thankful I have any work, though am still irritated at how I am being taken advantage of in such a tough time while the big boys maximize their profit margins to stay comfy:thumbsup:

 

[Pintor758NJ]

Cert a Pro? any good reviews from that company??? Hopefully they will find more subs if there is any in this town.

 

[BC_Painter]

Cert a Pro? any good reviews from that company??? Hopefully they will find more subs if there is any in this town.

CertaPro Calgary treated me quite well and fairly. The guy knew what he was doing going into the franchise.

It all depends on who is running the show. IF they are experienced and know how to run a business, how to paint estimate etc, it can work, but most of these guys get their own branding.