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Proclassic waterborne questions

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HollisPainting

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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have a kitchen cabinets job that came from a SW rep so I'm using their stuff.
The Proclassic waterborne is the obvious topcoat choice
I have a few questions based on this particular job

I'm repainting over the cabinet factorys finish which I assume is some high test alkyd and has a stronger bond than anything I might apply. Also I'm not changing color which is unusual
There is some fine bead detailing which they are worried about losing with to many coats.
Do I need to prime? It's only about bond and not blocking (same color)

Also how do I get the smoothest finish. 3-4 thin coats or lay it on thick and let it do its thing?
I have a brand new Graco 4 stage turbine and matching hvlp gun.
Have both #5 and #6 fluid set. Which will be easier to achieve my goal (smooth)
Will proclassic bond well enough
If a primer is necessary which SW product will be best
Lastly is there an extender /thinner for PC waterborne
I don't think a latex extender would work but an oil based one wouldn't seem appropriate either
Thanks a million.
 
kdpaint

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#2 ·
My money is on SW Multi Surface Acrylic, especially for its adhesion. Proclassic waterborne will never adhere without priming. MSE is a muuuuuuuuch better bet for adhesion. I tried it out a few times, and really like it. Someone else on PT compared it to PPG Breakthrough, but with a slower blocking time. Plus, it's harder than Proclassic.

Obviously, a thorough cleaning and sanding is indicated for any topcoat product.

2 coats of MSE, or a prime and 2X of Proclassic.
 
S

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#4 ·
If you go with ProClassic, laying it on thick and letting it do its thing is definitely not the way to go. As kdpaint says, clean, sand, prime first, then a series of thin coats.
 
Rbriggs82

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#6 · (Edited)
kdpaint said:
My money is on SW Multi Surface Acrylic, especially for its adhesion. Proclassic waterborne will never adhere without priming. MSE is a muuuuuuuuch better bet for adhesion. I tried it out a few times, and really like it. Someone else on PT compared it to PPG Breakthrough, but with a slower blocking time. Plus, it's harder than Proclassic.

Obviously, a thorough cleaning and sanding is indicated for any topcoat product.

2 coats of MSE, or a prime and 2X of Proclassic.
Click to expand...
You beat me to the punch. I've been playing around with the multi surface this week. I put it over Proclassic oil with out sanding first and an hour later I couldn't scratch it off.

Then I got some cabinet doors at the habit for Humanity ReStore. They were sample doors from a cabinet showroom. Nice wood finish on them for a $1 a piece I bought 15 of them for testing and making my own samples. Anyways again I put it on without sanding couldn't scratch it off within an hour.

On another door I did half with the SW extreme bonding primer and the other half with the multipurpose primer. After an overnight dry I could scratch them both off. The extreme primer did better but still not even close to the multipurpose.

Moral of the story if you're using SW for a cabinet job go with the multi surface. It's pretty easy to use, it adheres amazingly, and it dries to a pretty awesome looking finish.

Sent from my LG-H810 using Tapatalk
 
R

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#14 ·
Rbriggs82 said:
You beat me to the punch. I've been playing around with the multi surface this week. I put it over Proclassic oil with out sanding first and an hour later I couldn't scratch it off.

Then I got some cabinet doors at the habit for Humanity ReStore. They were sample doors from a cabinet showroom. Nice wood finish on them for a $1 a piece I bought 15 of them for testing and making my own samples. Anyways again I put it on without sanding couldn't scratch it off within an hour.

On another door I did half with the SW extreme bonding primer and the other half with the multipurpose primer. After an overnight dry I could scratch them both off. The extreme primer did better but still not even close to the multipurpose.

Moral of the story if you're using SW for a cabinet job go with the multi surface. It's pretty easy to use, it adheres amazingly, and it dries to a pretty awesome looking finish.

Sent from my LG-H810 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

I've got a brand, spanking new SW rep and he is telling me that the MSE is their version of Breakthrough and has entered a good price (so I can give it a whirl). I'm interested in these type test y'all are doing. Did you brush or spray the doors? When brushing, I just can't see MSE lay out nearly as nice as Advance, but maybe I'm wrong. I like what I'm reading about adhesion, but the brushed finish is gonna be key.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
stelzerpaintinginc.

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Licensed General Contractor, Painting Contractor, Christmas Light Installer
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#15 ·
HollisPainting said:
Stupid question
Could I mix eggshell and gloss to get a sheen somewhere in the middle? Or doesn't it work that way.
Click to expand...
Not a stupid question at all. Yes, you could mix it, but trying to homogenize it with no sheen inconsistencies can be a challenge. Typically, it won't be right in the middle either. For example, hypothetically, if the sheen value of eggshel was a 25 and semi a 75, combining the 2 wouldn't yield a 50. Probably closer to 40. If you do this, mix extremely well, mix often, and make a batch big enough to do the entire project. The chances of you being able to re-create a home-brew sheen to match would be slim. Heck, it's hard enough for the paint stores to do it with set figures and calibrated measurements.
 
Rbriggs82

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#16 ·
radio11 said:
I've got a brand, spanking new SW rep and he is telling me that the MSE is their version of Breakthrough and has entered a good price (so I can give it a whirl). I'm interested in these type test y'all are doing. Did you brush or spray the doors? When brushing, I just can't see MSE lay out nearly as nice as Advance, but maybe I'm wrong. I like what I'm reading about adhesion, but the brushed finish is gonna be key.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
I haven't sprayed it yet. I will soon, my parents just redid their kitchen and added a bunch of cabinets. Once I have time I'm going to spray the doors and brush/roll the boxes with the multi surface and spray one of the sample doors I have.

Your SW rep is right it's very close to breakthrough but it has a little more body to it and I think it covers better. The brushed finish is pretty much the same as breakthrough, pretty darn good but not as good as advance.

Sent from my LG-H810 using Tapatalk
 
PACman

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#18 ·
PRC said:
Give it a try. Sometimes one sheen is dominant to a degree. So 50/50 doesn't always work the way you might think.
Click to expand...
Having done sheen adjustments in a plant I would suggest that the eggshell would be the dominant sheen. I would start somewhere around 60/40 to get a nice satin.(60% gloss-40% eggshell)
 
S

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#20 ·
PACman said:
Having done sheen adjustments in a plant I would suggest that the eggshell would be the dominant sheen. I would start somewhere around 60/40 to get a nice satin.(60% gloss-40% eggshell)
Click to expand...
So the gloss would therefore be the recessive sheen? Paint genetics. :jester:

Seriously though, to achieve a semi-gloss would you suggest a 50/50 mix of eggshell and gloss? I'm wanting to try the Pro Industrial Multi Surface Acrylic but usually need a semigloss for trim and doors.
 
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