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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I recently accepted a job to repaint some very old and twice painted metal cabinets in a fine home. I took a drawer to the nearest SW and they matched the powder blue very well. Without testing we all assumed that they had a very slick coat of oil based paint on them. There was a lot of yellow on them and I was worried about blocking this or getting it off, so the guy behind the counter said, let me see if I can just wipe it off with some denatured alcohol since this wouldn't affect oil paint. Well, it turned out the second redo was just on the fronts of everything in a high quality latex and the rest was very glossy oil. It even appeared that he had varnished the backs of the doors at some point and this was yellowing some. I guess the yellow on the fronts of the doors and drawers, which was not on all of it, was cooking oil.

So, he tells me that the ProClassic waterbased stuff that I have been painting with for a long time does not need a primer that I can degloss-point and shoot. I called SW technical and they concurred!

Metal cabinets needing repainting does not come up too much for me and I have ALWAYS used some form of industrial enamel and recall on the last one, the fog from my hvlp got on my plastic covered flloor making it unpleasantly sticky etc. So I was ready to try this easier cleaner, greener method.

Does anybody have any first hand knowledge about ommitting primer and going over oil paint with ProClassic waterbased? :wallbash:
 

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It's possible to get by with a good deglossing and cleaning agent like Krud Kutter and some scuff sanding but I personally prefer to also use a quality bonding primer (UMA by X-I-M is my preference) when switching from oil to latex.
 
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I once accepted similar advice from the guy at the paint store, and he's a guy who is usually right. A week later I spent two days removing failed paint, priming, and re-painting the cabinets.........just sayin
 

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Just a word of caution I shot some doors with Pro Classic in HVLP and was very disappointed with the results. Seems I had to thin so much for the HVLP. Let me clarify my HVLP is a really cheapo model. Finished with airless and everything was fine. Have read on here that 4 stage models will shoot it without thinning and some guys have used 3 stage with success. Don't know what you have but maybe want to try on something else first.
 

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This is true. I sanded, krudcuttered, rinsed and painted Ultra Spec semi (not a bad paint, but no one's idea of a super great one either) over oil baseboard, and 6 months later, that stuff is not coming off. Not with fingernail, x'd and blue taped, hardly even with a sharp 5in1. And Advance is a bit nicer than PC.
 

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Just a word of caution I shot some doors with Pro Classic in HVLP and was very disappointed with the results. Seems I had to thin so much for the HVLP. Let me clarify my HVLP is a really cheapo model. Finished with airless and everything was fine. Have read on here that 4 stage models will shoot it without thinning and some guys have used 3 stage with success. Don't know what you have but maybe want to try on something else first.
I never reduce PC latex, other than Flotrol for brushing.
I use a FF rac tip and my graco 395 because that stuff is thick!

Side story-

I sprayed some properly oil primed and sanded cabinets with PC latex and shot the unprepped formica back splash below it. We figured we'd be re-doing backsplashes later anyway. 4 years later, it is still there and passes the fingernail test.
 

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I've put exterior acrylic over worn out, oxidized, industrial enamel and it bonded like crazy. Then again, I've seen old, interior oil that was so hard and slick that it was just daring you to try it. I think you just have to look at each job on it's own and use your best judgement.Most of the time a good prep job and bonding primer is worth the trouble.
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
Just a word of caution I shot some doors with Pro Classic in HVLP and was very disappointed with the results. Seems I had to thin so much for the HVLP. Let me clarify my HVLP is a really cheapo model. Finished with airless and everything was fine. Have read on here that 4 stage models will shoot it without thinning and some guys have used 3 stage with success. Don't know what you have but maybe want to try on something else first.
I sprayed the doors and drawers with a 413 tip and my airless yesterday---I know the bond will be good on the side that had previously been painted in latex. The backs and interiros of the drawers were solvent but we did a really really good job of sanding down the gloss, used some rust primer after heavy sanding those areas. I broke down and ordered an 5 stage HVLP which they say will have the power to atomize latex, but I had a 3 stage in the past and a couple of those el cheapos Gracos from LOWES ( OK for thinned StaysClear etc.) and they all had similar problems.........they will get their rig back if it does not perform as stated. Delivery got delayed because of the snow so we shall see. I am going to--I think-brush the cases except the bigger side panels because they do not want to take the stuff out---or I might try taping and using that taper I have that uses rolls of plastic and spraying, just depends on how good I can brush which is pretty damn good or when it arrives. Freaking ProClassic has gotten so damn expensive. I have to paint the refrigerator to match---I am probably going to use automotive paint for th
 

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My Titan rep suggested spraying latex PC with the #5 cap and thin with one capful of xim extender to mostly full gun cup of paint. I can't confirm as I haven't sprayed it with hvlp. Always had great success shooting it with 310 & 312 ff tips.
 

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My Titan rep suggested spraying latex PC with the #5 cap and thin with one capful of xim extender to mostly full gun cup of paint. I can't confirm as I haven't sprayed it with hvlp. Always had great success shooting it with 310 & 312 ff tips.

As stated, that's the key is to get the right needle and nozzle for the material. I'd suggest using some Flotrol added into the mix. The reason why is if your spraying lighter coats (less material) the HVLP is going to blow air as well, drying things out quickly. I've had issues with PC before with touch-ups where the sheen doesn't come out the same, even though it's from the same bucket. So..it's crucial to get all the passes overlapped and done correctly the first time. Extend the drying time and it will all level out nicely. PC is awesome stuff! I'm using 10 gals of it now for some drywall in a house we're building.

Good luck.
 

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As stated, that's the key is to get the right needle and nozzle for the material. I'd suggest using some Flotrol added into the mix. The reason why is if your spraying lighter coats (less material) the HVLP is going to blow air as well, drying things out quickly. I've had issues with PC before with touch-ups where the sheen doesn't come out the same, even though it's from the same bucket. So..it's crucial to get all the passes overlapped and done correctly the first time. Extend the drying time and it will all level out nicely. PC is awesome stuff! I'm using 10 gals of it now for some drywall in a house we're building.

Good luck.
That's exactly the problem I had was the air. Went to airless was happy with the results. My SW rep told me not to add Flotrol to PC as it already had the levelers in it and would self level. And to tell the truth on what I have brushed and rolled it seems like he was right. Maybe try and see.
 

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PC is awesome stuff! I'm using 10 gals of it now for some drywall in a house we're building.
Good luck.
Man, I know what my price is on that stuff and I can't imagine using it on drywall, not that it wouldn't work, just expensive. What's the application?
 
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