unemployment nightmare
1 - 20 of 21 Posts
Joined
·
5,097 Posts
If you fired him, dispute it. He will definitely milk it out til the end if you don't.
Joined
·
2,451 Posts
It can vary from state to state
But generally, he with the mos paperwork wins
Tie goes to worker (...er, ex-worker)
To fire someone for anything short of (and the terms and specifics will vary), willful disobedience, theft, fraud, or intoxication you'd better have some warnings
Even with chronic lateness and "breach of duty" it helps to have something to back you up
If you issued verbal warnings, you could have a chance (depending on the state)
But really, the best bet if you want to fire someone is to write them up
If you actually get to the third one, you can fire them and no judgment should go their way
Though often the write-ups piss off the person and they leave voluntarily which is just as good
If you've got no clear verbal warnings don't even bother
If you've got at least three verbal warnings it's a tough call
If you've got three written warnings (even if they don't sign them) you're golden
But generally, he with the mos paperwork wins
Tie goes to worker (...er, ex-worker)
To fire someone for anything short of (and the terms and specifics will vary), willful disobedience, theft, fraud, or intoxication you'd better have some warnings
Even with chronic lateness and "breach of duty" it helps to have something to back you up
If you issued verbal warnings, you could have a chance (depending on the state)
But really, the best bet if you want to fire someone is to write them up
If you actually get to the third one, you can fire them and no judgment should go their way
Though often the write-ups piss off the person and they leave voluntarily which is just as good
If you've got no clear verbal warnings don't even bother
If you've got at least three verbal warnings it's a tough call
If you've got three written warnings (even if they don't sign them) you're golden
Joined
·
2,451 Posts
I suppose it varies by state, but the states I'm familiar with your "bill" from the "pool" goes up if you have claims "against" you
So yeah, you pay more when you've got claims (unless you dispute and win)
So yeah, you pay more when you've got claims (unless you dispute and win)
Joined
·
551 Posts
Absolutely,
I learned this all the hard way. Don't let it eat you up. Just set up the systems needed to ensure it doesn't happen again. My situation frustrated me no end, I'd just dwell on it constantly.
How could this guy just sit at home living off the system while I'm still out here busting my butt everyday? Easy, he knew the system and I didn't. Sad when your employee knows the unemployment system better than you. I fired a total dirtbag last year for not showing up, showing up late, that kind of stuff. I fought it hard but he got his unemployment.
Why? NO WRITTEN WARNINGS!
Put it in writing and have them sign off on it.
Mack
Joined
·
551 Posts
In Vermont, it isn't that the person literally collects against your account. He collects against your rating. Say I have a certain rating with the sate unemployment office. If I lay off guys in a fashion considered by the state to be average then my rate is unaffected. If I lay off in a way that is above average, meaning I lay off more people than the average, my rate goes up.
Mack
Joined
·
1,493 Posts
Unemployment is nothing but an insurance policy similar to WC. The more clams you have the high your rate.
I had an employee in another business that put in a claim after I legitimately terminated her. She was kind of a friend and made some stupid decisions because of a relationship that she was in so I didn’t dispute the claim. It was in the first year or two of the business so my payroll was under 50k annually. The way unemployment works is they compare the amount of claims against your payroll and the ratio works out to be your rate and because the claim came in early in the business with low payrolls our rate skyrocketed and took a couple years to adjust back to where it was supposed to be. Over the next 3 years my payroll grew to 250k and the high rate for that first year was multiplied against higher payroll as I grew. She was out for 6 months then milked it for another 3 months and probably only took in 7k-8k in benefits but I kept track of how much the extra premium cost me over the next few years and it cost me more than 20k MORE because of this one claim. It would have been cheaper to just pay her to go away.
Never again! Since then we dot every “I” and cross every “t” and dispute EVERY claim that comes up. We have never laid anybody off and will tell everyone when they are terminated that if a claim is put in we will fight it to try to cut it off before it happens. I hate to see anyone down on their luck but if they are terminated there is no reason for me to pay for their stupid decisions! Our state can and will issue benefits even if they are terminated for certain reasons but it will not go against your account or rate if you fight it.
ps: if Billary or Barach gets in office you might as well plan on downsizing now. Since we are all evil business owners we will all need to give up all that money we are making to give of our employees FREE health insurance, 48 months of unemployment, pay their mortgage for them, and encourage them to file workers' comp claims. VOTE REPUBLICAN or start preparing your business.
I had an employee in another business that put in a claim after I legitimately terminated her. She was kind of a friend and made some stupid decisions because of a relationship that she was in so I didn’t dispute the claim. It was in the first year or two of the business so my payroll was under 50k annually. The way unemployment works is they compare the amount of claims against your payroll and the ratio works out to be your rate and because the claim came in early in the business with low payrolls our rate skyrocketed and took a couple years to adjust back to where it was supposed to be. Over the next 3 years my payroll grew to 250k and the high rate for that first year was multiplied against higher payroll as I grew. She was out for 6 months then milked it for another 3 months and probably only took in 7k-8k in benefits but I kept track of how much the extra premium cost me over the next few years and it cost me more than 20k MORE because of this one claim. It would have been cheaper to just pay her to go away.
Never again! Since then we dot every “I” and cross every “t” and dispute EVERY claim that comes up. We have never laid anybody off and will tell everyone when they are terminated that if a claim is put in we will fight it to try to cut it off before it happens. I hate to see anyone down on their luck but if they are terminated there is no reason for me to pay for their stupid decisions! Our state can and will issue benefits even if they are terminated for certain reasons but it will not go against your account or rate if you fight it. ps: if Billary or Barach gets in office you might as well plan on downsizing now. Since we are all evil business owners we will all need to give up all that money we are making to give of our employees FREE health insurance, 48 months of unemployment, pay their mortgage for them, and encourage them to file workers' comp claims. VOTE REPUBLICAN or start preparing your business.
Joined
·
5,097 Posts
Yes, I was assuming the OP had the documentation. I posted a form that we use in this thread
http://www.painttalk.com/showthread.php?t=380
If I get a chance I will post some other forms I use for termination. I have successfully defended three claims. My payroll is getting up there. A small raise in rates is one I will feel.
http://www.painttalk.com/showthread.php?t=380
If I get a chance I will post some other forms I use for termination. I have successfully defended three claims. My payroll is getting up there. A small raise in rates is one I will feel.
Joined
·
2,385 Posts
I wouldn't just ignore it & hope for the best. Fighting it will take a few hours out of your day, but you chance winning the case (although it's hard in most situations). I know two people who have filed even know they deserved it every bit. When their ex-employers denied them they didn't even try apealing it as they thought they would lose the case anyways. You could be lucky like that?
Joined
·
4,698 Posts
We had a lady from our dry cleaners quit and try to collect unemployment. We had to fill out some paper work with our statements and send the paper work in. A week later we get a call from the unemployment office stating that she was filing. They asked if she had been fired. We told them that she quit. They wanted to know if we would take her back. Knowing she would never come back, we said yes, she still has a job if she wants. Unemployment denied.
Joined
·
152 Posts
I thought this was a politics-free area.
I recall hearing the same admonition before "Mr. Record Deficit" and "Mr. Record Borrowing" was appointed by the Supreme Court, btw, during which time the Republican Congress ran up record spending.
Joined
·
1,493 Posts
Joined
·
3,388 Posts
Couldn't you make your prospective employees sign something stating that your company will employe their services in different fasions. For instance - you own a painting company - but also a janitorial service as well - and when you feel like it - demote your employees to vaccuming at an agreed upon much much lower rate than painting - like minimum wage. So eventually the guy will just quit - or have him cleaning toilets or something.
Please explain how putting neocons like the present administration back in office, will help your biz?
Joined
·
1,493 Posts
Bushdude - see, there you go talking politics. You see, when Republicans talk like that you know it is really about business because, well, like the Dem's say - Republicans are for business and not the working man"
But, when a Democrat talks like that it is obvious that they do not like the evil business person and will do what they can to make it harder :thumbup:.
See, no politics here!:whistling2:
1 - 20 of 21 Posts
