[Brian]

Ken shared his new sell sheet, and it immediately gave me ideas. In fact, I've developed something very similar since.

I took his basic idea, but recreated every element to fit my own business. Is this stealing his idea? Or, as I intimated in the original thread, is it just flattery?

I have 2 reasons for posing the question. 1. Some people (present company excluded) seem to think that unless an idea is completely original, it isn't an independent idea; 2. Some people think that if you get an idea from others, you must credit them with every application you make of it.

Personally, I think these are both false ideas. Learning from others moves civilization forward. (If you disagree, then you need to invent your own paint.) And I can't begin to remember everyone I've learned something from, let alone credit them everytime I used one of their ideas. That would be paralyzing.

But enough about me. What do you think about using ideas from others?

Brian Phillips

 

[vermontpainter]

The way I look at, its like music. How many songs are based on a simple I-IV-V progression? How many songs are a basic 12 bar blues? How many jazz progressions have the I-VI-II-V-I movement happening? Variation is the key. You have your own lyrics, melody, harmonies and solos happening over the progression that Ken played. Its not being a cover band. Its being influenced.

I know I have been exposed to ideas here that I have applied to my own business, whether sales and marketing, field applications, or retention. Thats why we are really here: open exchange of ideas. The fact that Ken trusts this group enough to display his idea for feedback speaks to that.

 

[HomeGuardPaints]

I think you're in the clear, I can't speak for Ken but the only reason I would ever have a problem with someone using one of my materials is if the copied it word for word and/or was directly competing against me in my market.

-Mickey

 

[vermontpainter]

Stealing is like if someone copies text or even pages from your website and pastes it onto their own and puts their name on it. Can you imagine that?

 

[GMack]

When my brother took a job as a mechanic's helper when we were kids, my father gave him some advice: "Steal . . . with your eyes."

Watching somebody perform a task successfully and then emulating the means they took to be successful is not stealing. It's only smart, an in our cases, good business.

 

[timhag]

Brian, from that same thread I am going to use Kens formula to clean my roof. Am I stealing Kens formula? Ken had the heart to share his formula with me in a public forum, with that being said, is there anyone out there that may use this formula stealing? I am grateful to have you guys to turn 2 when needed and knowing you guys are there to help. I'm sure Kens doesn't feel you are stealing his ideas because if that were fact he would have never posted.

 

[Brian]

The way I look at, its like music. How many songs are based on a simple I-IV-V progression? How many songs are a basic 12 bar blues? How many jazz progressions have the I-VI-II-V-I movement happening? Variation is the key. You have your own lyrics, melody, harmonies and solos happening over the progression that Ken played. Its not being a cover band. Its being influenced.

Okay, I'll admit that I don't understand any of the Roman numeral stuff. But I will agree that it is about being influenced. We hear something, or read something, and it can create our own ideas.

I know I have been exposed to ideas here that I have applied to my own business, whether sales and marketing, field applications, or retention. Thats why we are really here: open exchange of ideas. The fact that Ken trusts this group enough to display his idea for feedback speaks to that.

I understand this, and completely agree. We are here to share ideas. And I agree that what Ken did was great, not only in his display of trust, but the actual thing he shared.

I don't mean this to sound like I'm a jerk, but after 22 years in business and 10 years on various boards, new ideas are becoming harder and harder to find. When I find one, I'm like a kid in a candy shop.

Brian Phillips

 

[crow]

Ya, your stealin.

 

[Brian]

Maybe I should clarify. I don't think learning from others is stealing. I'd still be in diapers and saying goo-goo if I didn't learn from others.

However, I've noticed that some people seem to think it is stealing. I've also noticed that others think that unless they discover everything, they aren't independent.

I was trying to open some eyes, but not my own.

Brian Phillips

 

[vermontpainter]

Ultimately, many of us are here sharing ideas to try to raise the standards of our trade. Some of us want to make our business more profitable, others want to hear which primer everyone prefers. Whatever the case, the information here is in the spirit of improving our businesses and our profession as a whole. It has certainly had that effect for me, and for many people here that I talk to.

And its true, the longer you are in this business wracking your own mind and those of others, the harder it is to find new ideas, or innovative variations on existing ideas. Now, I am off to compile a handbook to be titled "Out of the Field". Ha!

 

[George Z]

What does Ken (with a benefit of the doubt) think?

 

[NEPS.US]

It's the first thng I thought of when he posted it. Some lurker is gonna plagiarize this one. I doubt that he cares. It really matters what you do with it and I'm sure after a 2 minute conversation with Ken, a customer knows he's the real deal.

The tool doesn't work if you dont kow how to use it properly.

 

[plainpainter]

Someone once defined creativity as the art of disguising all your influences.

 

[daArch]

Brian,

First, there are no original ideas.

Second, being inspired by another's action, words, or product is all part of evolving. Heck, he may see something in your take-off that he wants to use.


But, Ken should input on this. But unless it's a direct copy with the only changes being your company replacing his company name, I can't see a problem.

 

[Brian]

I've sent Ken a copy of the ad. I'll let you know what he says.

Brian Phillips

 

[PressurePros]

Hey guys sorry about the delays. Its nuts around here. Brian, use it in good health. Anything I post I know is going into a public arena. I appreciate the thoughts and good display of character on your part, Brian, but all I did was fuel that creative part of your brain that may have been on siesta ;-) Lord knows mine can be found napping or buried in numbers analysis on any given day.

 

[bikerboy]

No offense to anybody's creative output, but there are very few "original ideas". Mainly there are improvements on existing or little know concepts and ideas.

That said a direct copy is pretty uncool. IMHO

 

[Painting4Profit]

I am sure the first service business owner that used the term "free estimates" in his/her advertisments realized that other people would copy it, use it and make it no longer an effective differentiating business claim:whistling2:

You already got your answer from Ken. He is ok with it and i wish you well with it. Let us know how it did for you.