Behr is no good for these two reasons:

1) you have to go to the store and pick it up
2) you have to pay for it before the job starts


Compared to piant that can be ordered from the phone, delivered and payed for later, after you make a draw,,,,,,,, you can see how inferior Behr paint really is, even if it is way cheaper!!!!

 

Behr

Holy crap its Capt-sheetrock!

 

not all behr paints are created equal, some are worse than others. the problem i have with behr is that they market it as a superior product and price it as one too. there are much better paints on the market for the same price or even a lower price. the product data sheets are very vague and could possibly confuse the average DIY person that they maket toward. paint and primer in one data sheets show recommended primer/systems for certain applications such as an oil primer or primer sealer for new plaster,drywall or tannins under the section "properly prepared surfaces" and then go on to say(2 coats minimum required on new or uncoated surfaces). 2 coats of what? primer? finish paint after primer? this does not look like a "paint and primer in one" to me. to me it looks like you may need 2 coats of primer and 2 or more coats of finish paint. the only place that i can find where it says 2 coats of paint only, is over properly prepared painted surfaces. that can be achieved with most paints anyway when priming is not needed. does this make all paints " paint and primer in one"? if this were a true paint and primer in one, you would assume that you would use one coat as a primer and two coats as a finish over any surface like the advertising suggest. it is not marketed that way and the data sheets do not support this either.

 

Ok, maybe I should clarify a bit more. What I'm trying to find out is more of how to explain to a HO why I don't use Behr. Of course I prefer not paying for product up front and rarely do, on the occasions I must for some reason, I explain to the client and up my deposit to reflect the added cost I must carry.

Thanks Mike, that is certainly helpful for explaining why "paint-n-primer in one" is a misnomer. So basically it comes down to overall value (quality of paint * cost) it seems.

And although the premium plus actually covered quite well, HO paid $19 for a quart!

 

Ok, maybe I should clarify a bit more. What I'm trying to find out is more of how to explain to a HO why I don't use Behr. Of course I prefer not paying for product up front and rarely do, on the occasions I must for some reason, I explain to the client and up my deposit to reflect the added cost I must carry.

Thanks Mike, that is certainly helpful for explaining why "paint-n-primer in one" is a misnomer. So basically it comes down to overall value (quality of paint * cost) it seems.

And although the premium plus actually covered quite well, HO paid $19 for a quart!

wow, $19/qt. thats only $76/gal if you buy it by the quart. the advertising speaks louder than the pro painter in this case. if this is what they want then give it to them if they are supplying the paint. i wouldnt guarantee it and i would charge more for the hassles involved in the extra coats that may be needed. imo, behr is a cheap product that gives cheap results in most cases. i know people that swear by it but i have yet to find any standards of testing that prove any claims on their products performance. as i said, there are much better products at those prices.

 

the op,

interior: less scrubability, durability, color/tinting uniformity from gallon to gallon

exterior: less % of solids, durability, color/tinting uniformity, adhesion, workability= more labor costs (higher prices for ho),

Or just go with the flow and charge them more for it and don't offer any guarantees. The more you know about paints the more you could offer as far as info goes.

 

Want to hear my thoughts on it?

 

Do tell,,,:thumbup:

 

Jack is the Worlds foremost leading expert on cheap paint .............:whistling2:

 

$36/gal isn't cheap.

 

I wonder if the main reason why everyone here hates the paint is due to the deal with having to go to the box store to get it. Like some sort of complex disorder where you have to lower your self esteem and be seen at box store standing in line with over weight homeowners. I would think also all or most of the finish products we have seen that were finished with behr were done by the HO and look like chit.

I wonder if Behr ever started to open up little small stores like our local paint ones would things change? I bet they would.

I have never used any of the finish products, I have used their slow drying oil primers and have nothing at all to complain about.

Pat

 

I wonder if the main reason why everyone here hates the paint is due to the deal with having to go to the box store to get it. Like some sort of complex disorder where you have to lower your self esteem and be seen at box store standing in line with over weight homeowners. I would think also all or most of the finish products we have seen that were finished with behr were done by the HO and look like chit.

I wonder if Behr ever started to open up little small stores like our local paint ones would things change? I bet they would.

I have never used any of the finish products, I have used their slow drying oil primers and have nothing at all to complain about.

Pat

I think not, they are making billions of $ now marketing the paint and primer in one, why bother?:blink: Very few pros would go to any place that sells crap( except JP):whistling2:

 

Pat, I haven't gotten that vibe from the replies here. Mostly that the paint isn't worth the cost. The single experience I had with premium plus was good, but the price was outrageous. I could have bought Aura and saved the HO money.

 

My suggestion is that you use the stuff and form your own opinion. Opinions will vary here...and mine is different from others. The regular Behr ($18 - $22) has been pretty good while the premium plus ($33) has performed quite poorly...but that's just me.

Generally speaking, it's lower performing paint and I try to discourage HO's from using it. However if we must do so, I give them two coats with the stuff at my price and then we either part ways or they ante up more $$$ if they want more coats.

The way my contract is structured, I really don't give a sh1t if they want me to paint lowfat milk on the walls.

 

Make your own opinions on paint when you use it. I dont care what anyone says the behr paint and primer in 1 is awesome for interior use. And customers freakin love it.

 

Make your own opinions on paint when you use it.
good point

And customers freakin love it.

why do you think customers love it?

I can think of only 3 possibilities:

a) they have used it to paint a wall or two and were deluded into thinking the spotty one coat mess looked good

b) the millions of dollars in marketing this product focused on a specific demographic has been very successful

C) they were at the store getting some light bulbs and they decided to pick out paint colors there plus a and b above.

 

I just painted two bed rooms and a master all rooms had dark base colors . Reds , green , grey all accent colors covered in 2 coats no problem. Right ! standing in line at home depot sucks , but if you wear whites and talk to people . You find work there . 32 a gal for ultra here in Austin tx
I like using it for dark colors.

 

as a repair guy I do not know a lot about applications but they flood tv with the primer and paint in one commercials and somehow they got the top ranking in paint from Consumer Reports. I believe they are advertising to the diy'ers but ho's see the ads also and believe it is a superior product. I get a lot of ho's coming in here with the Wagner sprayers and they want to know why they cannot paint as fast as the commercials on tv show. some people:no:

 

If you find yourself talking too much with your customers and prospects about Behr paint, rather than spending alot of time worrying about how to educate them about behr paint, your energy might be spent tweaking the marketing plan to get to customers who want to talk about different brands of paint, the ones you prefer. You don't prefer behr, do you?

 

I assume this is addressed to me (op) so I will answer.

This actually rarely comes up, it just happened to twice in the past week, and both clients let me use my own paint regardless. One client was a cheap bastard but the other absolutely values quality over price, I was the second most expensive bid out of four.

She simply had used Behr before on her own house and liked it, I told her I did not prefer it and she trusted my judgment. This was enough for her but maybe not for my next client.

I am a young guy (and look it) so I feel like I have to be perfect in my presentation. I may be paranoid but I think every HO is doubting my expertise because of my age. Thank you all for helping me fine tune my pitch :thumbup:

 

Behr's market place is to HO's, since HO's do not normally buy my paint I hardly ever use it so where it ranks or how it performs does not really effect me. I honestly think that people hate the box stores so much because they want to distance themselves from the diy market.

 

yes, behr paint is great to the average HO that uses it and has no problem with spending an entire weekend in one room to make it right. the average pro can make it work even better with some years of experience under their belts. the thing that i am looking for is a paint that can perfom with a painter that is on the move and getting paid for production. a production painter needs good tools and good paints that will allow them to produce good results without baby sitting the last 3 or 4 thousand sq/ft done hours ago. the average happy HO is just pleased with the new color even if it requires an extra coat and a few more gallons to make it right. that can not be accepted in a bridge span that is thirty thousand sq/ft. 1 or 2 mils can make or break a job when you are dealing with #'s like that. we can not afford to add extra coats on multimillion$ jobs so why should a HO or contractor be ok with this on a thousand dollar job.. money is money. like the old saying"time is money" imo "materials is money too". why would you not use a proven and tested product that has consistant results and a proven track record.

 

Tell me why it sucks w/o generalizations.

 

where should we start?

 

I bought a used sprayer off of a painter once. He used BEHR a lot on exteriors...until he did his own house, which was peeling in different spots all over. He felt terrible about having applied it to so many houses. (Not sure which kind of BEHR he used.)

I've decided not to use BEHR. Here's why:

A bunch of people who's opinions I respect claim there's problems with it. They don't seem to have extremely concrete reasons, but it's not worth risking putting up a product that may fail. There's plenty of paints that get good professional reviews.

Failing paint is no joke. Even if we don't have a watertite case against BEHR, there's enough concern about the products that they just shouldn't be used. This is especially true for exteriors. With the interior, the risk is really more that you'll waste your time, which may cost you money depending on how you bid the job. Is it worth the risk to you?

JP seems to have found certain applications for the Premium Plus Ultra. Great...I'll do more trials with paints once my company grows. For now, I'll play it as safe as possible. No gambling with my clients homes!

 

Dear H.O./ Potential client:

Although Behr has been awarded the highest National Consumer Awards year after year, I prefer to use materials provided by paint companies that vend from a specific location providing specific products.
The main reasons are these:

1) I have a long time business relationship with S.W. that spans back 12+ years. Sure I've had a few errors that caused minor 'hiccups' in my schedule, which were always remedied without my client incurring any extra fees or completely ruining the contract.
2) I have an actual full time on site S.W. sales rep. and a huge support staff that responds instantaneously to any issues that may arise.
3) as a long time S.W. contractor, my prices are the lowest possible, which i in turn pass on to my clients
4) having used S.W. exclusively for over a decade, i am familiar with their product line, assuring that i am never 'learning a new product' in your home.


While Behr is a 'best selling' paint, i can assure you that Home Depot cannot provide the Gold Standard level of personal care quite as effectively as a paint company that has over 140 years of history such as Sherwin Williams has.


let's not forget, much like many painting companies, Home Depot rode the wave of the housing bubble to grow into what now, during the fallout appears to be a 'top heavy' company.

 

I just tell them Consumer Reports only tests “Consumer Grade” products. They don’t rate professional, or commercial grade products. That’s usually all I need to say.

 

So you essentially lie to them? CS tests ALL pro and HO grade paints. Painters seem to be beholden to corporate BS advertising and perks to use their paint. The fact is, many of the "evil" HO paints are the equal to brands such as Ben Moore who have been living off their reputations from days gone by. BM puts out a product like "Aura" and the rubes flock around it and declare it superior. I used it on several high end jobs and it flashed more than any brand Ive ever tried. Fast forward two weeks with a similar job. I ended up using SW a200. The result is that the less expensive SW product came out exactly the way the homeowner wanted.

 

I have Behr Ultra on my front door ( previous owner ) Pre primed fiberglass door....peeling in sheets, and its under a huge porch so it gets no, or very little weathering. The home was built in 2008...so im assuming it was painted around then. I guess 3 years is a lifetime in Behr lingo...........

 

I guess 3 years is a lifetime in Behr lingo...........

That's why they don't provide healthcare to their employees.

 

And does anyone have experience with the premium plus line specifically as it is newer?

Premium Plus was out before Premium Plus Ultra. Ultra is the newest but its been out for over 5 years, close to 6.

I have Ultra exterior on a cedar shake rental house painted when Ultra came out. There is no peeling paint so far, no mildew and the house still has sheen. Pretty. Darn. Impressive.

 

I have no problem with Behr,,,, but then again I have "sheetrock" in my screen-name,,,,, so what could I possible know about paint????

 

I dont mind some of the behr interior paints, but their stains are crap and dont hold up at all.

 

After 2-3 yrs you can actually peel off the paint in chunk all the way down to plasterboard and even the plaster will come loose with the paint. If you inspect the plaster underneath you'll notice it's very soft and flaky. This will happen to either flat or semi with primer underneath. I can tell you from my experienced in basic chemistry this indicated that the paint has too much of either silicate or phosphate. That's because silica or phosphate will precipitate calcium and prevent it from bonding together. I did however, took the dry flat Behr paint that I grind into powder and tested for phosphate and it throw me off the chart.
My "speculation" is that Behr is using some kind of phosphorus base substance as paint additive. Ofcourse, these are the cheapest sources and very rich in phosphate and/or silicate. Unlike most high quality paint that derived from crude oil and then use mineral clay to build its cosistency, I think Behr is using a cheaper mix such as phosphorus vocalnic ashes.

 

To address the behr paint question.. I have had my !@# burned using there interior wall paints because the HO purchased it. On two different occasions I had the displeasure of using there products the first time was cutting and rolling ceilings I bid for 2 coats, it took 4 because the paint would dry so fast you could not even roll back into it with the a/c going. On the last coat I ran down to BM came back and finished the ceilings in 1 coat with BM. I have had this happen again for the same reason even added h20 to slow down the dry time and it made it no difference. stick with what you know works!!

 

In the future, test a small batch using Floetrol or XIM extender instead of water. I usually prefer the XIM.